[ZDP] ZDP

[Maik Roeder]

Hi Tom !

Tom Deprez wrote:
> Since a few weeks I'm starting to think that ZDP just doesn't want to be
> helped. When I first saw ZDP, I think it was already almost dead(forgive me
> if I'm wrong). I started ZBook and wrote some pages and some members of ZDP
> contributed and helped me a lot with it. Unfortunately, at a certain time
> also ZBook stopped, because of the simpel fact that we didn't got a
> reaction. So, why should somebody write something when NOBODY even wants to
> say: well I liked this part, but that... and here I've just something
> written down what can be contributed... but no, nothing!! So, are ZOPE
> people REALLY interested in documentation? They yell a lot about
> documentation, but when it is there, they don't look at it...

Maybe new drafts should be sent to the mailing list, so you can get some
reactions. 

The real problem seems to be that everyone is too busy, and that there are
too few people interested in helping. 

> Another point is that people working on ZDP don't follow a certain schedule.
> Partly because we all work on this during our free times, but also because
> we just don't have a general idea about ZDP! Also a few months ago (still
> old ZDP then), I wrote some specs and asked if people would look at it.
> Until now (and now it isn't possible anymore, because that site is gone), I
> hadn't got any reaction. It's funny, but now I sometimes see some new
> changes which actually already stood in these specs. So why didn't somebody
> just has a look at these specs? It makes people a little bit broken.

We now put such things in the Task Folder. If you have a suggestion, then
just put it up there. 

> At this moment I more liked the old ZDP. Possibly because the new site isn't
> finished yet, but more likely that I don't have a clue to where ZDP is
> heading! What to do with these old projects, like ZBook, ZFAQ? etc.... I
> like these. They now are pushed to the background and probalbly will never
> see the light again.

Well, the projects are not important for the visitors. The visitors just
want to get to the documentation.

When the member portal is finished, then you can find the 
projects there.

I think we are heading to a site where everyone chooses a community of
people sharing his or her interests. Then you have a subject and
a topic you would like to know more about, and share your ideas with
people having the same interests.

For me it is already working. When I do some research on a specific
topic, I try to figure out for which target audience it is interesting,
create a subject if necessary, and some topics under that.

It would also be cool if you could put an abstract from all ZBook
chapters into the Portal ! Then you can point to your chapter from
there, making some advertisement.

Also, I have been thinking about a News section on the front page,
and hiding the different portals just a little bit. So, we need to
make a news item out of every single change to the ZDP site ;-)

> At the moment I also don't see who's working on what and even who is working
> on ZDP. This is one of the key things to have a good working project. Also
> this is asked a few months back, but not much people sended us some
> information. How the hell can you coördinate something?

I have been working really slow the past 2 weeks, and only a few people
have done something on the site. So, there simply is not much to coordinate
right now.

> Argh, well, I'll just stop writing, before I upset people with my wrongly
> choosen words. A conversation like this can't be done through e-mail. It can
> only be done when talking around a table...

I don't mind some harsh words if they are justified.
 
> I only want to make the following clear:
> 
> Are people willing to make a good Zope Documentation Portal? 

All this only makes sense when someone from DC is sitting
with us on the table. We should contact mindlace, because it
is his job to help with the documentation.

> If so, we need to know these things :
> 
> 1. Who's willing to help? And what can he/she offer?

I can offer help in any respect.

> 2. What are the goals? Let us write them down and sort them out. Then we
> make a schedule and this will help us much further in the ZDP project.

The following article is really great:

http://www.photo.net/building-community/

> I'm willing to coördinate these 2 points, so just now let us talk and write
> down a schedule for the future.

Everyone should read the article, so we can start discussing.

Greetings,

Maik Röder