[Zope-CMF] Re: Tools as local utilities

[Philipp von Weitershausen]

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
> On 7 Feb 2007, at 00:36, Martin Aspeli wrote:
>> Eggs make your life easier, especially if you want to use tools like 
>> workingenv.py or zc.buildout.
> 
> Well, for simple work with the CMF like setting up a quick instance for 
> hacking and development *I do not want to use any tools*.

Who says you have to. It seems to me that the only people here 
complaining are the ones who aren't quite familiar with eggs yet.

Also, I seem to detect a general tone of skepticism against the new 
tools that the greater Python community is building. I can only 
encourage people to take a look at thigns like workingenv and 
zc.buildout and at what the Zope and Plone communities have done with 
these tools. Perhaps they don't allow you to use simple symlinks for 
deployment, but perhaps they offer something similiar, something even 
easier and a few additional extra features perhaps? It's worth at least 
checking these things out.

> I want to 
> retain the same ease I currently have where all I need to do is either 
> copy or link a few directories into the instance Products folder. It's 
> intuitive and very fast for a Zope 2 developer. If you can offer the 
> same ease and speed with a different approach, fine. But I don't see it 
> with those wondrous tools.

Eggs contain Python packages. How you deploy the Python packages is your 
choice. If you like copying or symlinking, fine. And, heck, you can 
still symlink your products to Products. Nobody's getting rid of 
Products. But please-oh-please let us start developing new things in 
regular packages so that we can

a) make use of the tools provided to us by the greater Python community

b) ease other Python programmers into Zope (no more weird Products, no 
more "Zope stinks", no more "Zope is its own universe"). Some of us 
*like* reaching out.

c) make things easier for *ourselves* (being able to test a simple 
Python package outside the context of a full-blown Zope instance is a 
tremendous win).

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