[Zope-dev] Re: Zope 2.7: OrderSupport for ObjectManager

[Andrew Sawyers]

Thanks for the warm welcome  :)
I'll elaborate on points in-line so see below.....

Yuppie wrote:

> Hi Andrew!
>
>
> Andrew Sawyers wrote:
>
>> I'll have to chime in since I saw something that's a bad assumption.
>
> Welcome to the discussion :)
>
>> Yuppie wrote:
>>
>>> Our first proposal was to add the ordering API to the default Folder.
>>
>>
>> The result of the discussion was OrderedFolder. That >makes it easier to
>> migrate to Zope3: If it is an OrderedFolder, the order of _objects is
>> important, if it is an Folder, we just can >discard _objects.
>> This is a *really* bad assumption; for several projects I've
>> monkey-patched folder to support ordering in custom CMS projects;  the
>> order of _objects is important to these folks.  I appologize for chiming
>> in so late in the game, but if requirements are being driven by that
>> assumption, it's not a safe one IMNSHO.
>
>
> So a better assumption would be:
>
> We don't know what people did with _objects, so _objects might be
> important.
>
> Right? 

Right, if  there's any discussion on considering a migration path into
Zope3 this can't be ignored.

>
>
> That means: All Zope2 Folders have to be converted to Zope3 Folders
> with OrderSupport (what ever OrderSupport would look like in Zope3).
>
> If that is the case, I can't see why the default Zope2 Folder can't
> have OrderSupport. Maybe you read the discussion I had with Shane
> about this issue
> <http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-coders/2002-December/002955.html>
> or ask him yourself. 

I quickly glanced over the thread and at first thought I disagree. 
Order is important to many people (or at least the appearance of order)
- and it's more then just sorting, because they want them sorted by
Title, but always 'X' to be the first item.  This may not be so
important to developers, but it's definately important to the end users
of the systems I've created in the past (for sure the past 3 projects). 
I'll talk to Shane and see if I understand the approaches they're
planning for Zope3 (I'm out of the loop on that doing project
work).....but so far I'm not convinced.

>
>
> I'm not sure if I did get all his arguments, but the point that
> convinced me is becoming weak.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Yuppie 

Cheers,
Andrew