[Zope] FW: [Zope] This is completely bogus but..

[Coleman, Bryan]

> Something which I have been tossing around in my head and am about to jump
> into with both feet is a Zope like archetecture for distributing user
> interfaces anywhere. Zope like functionality would be a sub set of the
> project. Display could be within a browser or within X or under Windows
> even. I would be extending the concetp of the user interface to include
> just about any output/input. I am thinking of tying it in alot more
> closely with XML as opposed to dtml or some simmiler construct. This would
> allow for easy extention of the definition language ie if there were not
> already a dtml-unless you could make one. If anyone is interested let me
> know. I have a site registered at sourceforge but am still working on the
> project plan. The primary development language will be python, but I want
> it to be open so components can be written in any language and I am
> considering forth for speed ups. ( I wonder if you could write a python
> interpriter in forth, hmmm...)
> 
> - Bryan Patrick Coleman
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Mike  Fletcher [SMTP:mfletch@tpresence.com]
> Sent:	Thursday, May 11, 2000 7:35 AM
> To:	zope@zope.org
> Subject:	RE: [Zope] This is completely bogus but..
> 
> There is little in the way of indirection or encapsulation within Zope.
> That is, most products reach directly into other products to find
> classes/functions. When you reload a product, to properly reload, you will
> need to reload every product which is dependent on that product.
> Furthermore, you'll need to track down every class and instance reference
> which uses the product's elements (which may be, for instance, stored in
> some global registry of available classes (which might be built by a given
> product), or might be in the object cache etc.) and rebuild/replace those
> items.
> 
> You could try clearing the object cache, scanning the global registries
> for
> potentially dependent instances or classes, then re-loading all products
> (in
> case some have global registries).  I don't think this will be an enormous
> amount better (time-wise) than restarting.  Nothing is particularly
> impossible, but the process is unlikely to be simple or straightforward
> given the current architecture.  
> 
> You could try re-architecting Zope so that it uses more of a traditional
> plug-in API, that is, some set of methods are registered/watched on an
> object, all interaction between the object and the system goes through
> that
> API.  Not sure about how you do stand-alone objects in that model, likely
> have to simply rebuild all objects when a product is rebuilt.
> 
> No simple solutions, but at least I'm not the one planning to work on it
> :)
> ,
> Mike
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: news-list.zope@innominate.de [mailto:news-list.zope@innominate.de]
> Sent: Thursday, May 11, 2000 8:06 AM
> To: zope@zope.org
> Subject: Re: [Zope] This is completely bogus but..
> 
> 
> Chris Withers wrote:
> > 
> > > This could be a good thing if we want to hotpatch a server of some
> sort.
> > >
> > > -Morten
> > 
> > There was a thread on this a while back but I don't think there was any
> > conclusive outcome.
> > 
> > I'd love so see Zope provide a facility for updating of products without
> > restarting the server. It'd make python product development time a lot
> > quicker and besides, restarting the server every time you rev a python
> > product or two isn't really the sort of thing you want in a production
> > system...
> > 
> > To be honest, I don't really see why you should need to restart the
> > server anyway...
> > 
> > Comments?
> 
> agree 100%.
> -- 
> heiko.stoermer@innominate.de
>                                                         innominate AG
>                                                      networkingpeople
> fon: +49.30.308806-0 fax: -77               web: http://innominate.de
> 
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