[Zope3-Users] Choosing between Bluebream, Zope2 and Grok

[Milind Khadilkar]

On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 11:43 AM, Thierry Florac <tflorac at ulthar.net> wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> Le Wed, 24 Oct 2012 07:45:50 +0530,
>   Milind Khadilkar <zedobject at gmail.com> a écrit:
>
> > Hello all Zope Users!
> > We are trying to decide on a Zope platform for, say, the next five
> > years. We have developed small products on Zope2 and Zope3 between
> > 2000 and 2008, and in Grok over the past couple of years, off and on.
> > We are looking to build as per customer requirements, and it would be
> > common sense to choose the platform as per requirement. However, with
> > a small team size, we can't spread ourselves thin over the three
> > platforms...Pyramid, Django and GAE also keep beckoning....
> >
> > We have seven revivable products in Zope2 (2.6 - 2.10), including one
> > in Plone. Some of them do not open in Zope 2.11...
> > Some of them use DTML for no reason now discernable.
> > Some of them use a very old version of ZODB.
> >
> > We have one big product in Zope 3.3.  Can we attempt converting it
> > from Zope 3 to Zope2?
> >
> > We have no real work done in Grok, but there is a level of
> > familiarity with it. Newer members of the team know neither Zope2 nor
> > Zope3.
> >
> > Making use of our past work is an important criterion for us.
> > Training new team members is another...
> >
> > What other things must we keep in mind when deciding on the platform?
> > Any pointers would help.
> >
> > Sorry for this rambling question.
> > Thanks in advance for your answers.
>
> Using Zope 2 for several years, I switched to Zope 3.3 probably five
> years ago and our latest developments since two years are based on ZTK
> and ZopeApp. We are really very happy with these!
>
> Having small teams of developers, mainly coming from the Java world,
> training them for recent environments was more "natural" and easier to
> them than it was for Zope 2.
>
> The main problem with these releases is that BlueBream "as is" is a
> dead project; I only used it as a base to create my new development
> environments based on recent releases of ZTK and ZopeApp packages.
> These ZTK and ZopeApp packages are still maintained (last release was
> in May, 2012) but don't seems to evolve much actually (even if
> development work seems to be visible in Launchpad). Development
> community on these packages don't seems to be very active or is, at
> least, hard to find! Same for Grok, for which the last release was 18
> months ago.
>
> Excluding Django, Pyramid seems to be the most active project actually
> among those you mentioned. And it can include many "old" Zope concepts
> (ZODB, traversing...). But I didn't had any time to test it until now...
>
> Best regards,
> Thierry
>
Thanks, Thierry.
Actually, there is a recent Grok release that is a well-kept secret:
http://grok.zope.org/releaseinfo/1.5.4/versions.cfg
I got the above info when we got into some windows-based problem on Grok
and I communicated on the list.

Besides, the Grok developers feel, probably rightly so, that Grok is
more-or-less feature complete and that widely-spaced releases are to be
expected. Another explanation is (as quoted): "Another reason why Grok
releases do not happen too often these times is,
that Grok meanwhile is merely an umbrella package for a couple of
outsourced packages (these grokcore.xxx packages). These packages are
frequently updated but normally only as bugfix releases which leaves the
Grok version number as-is."

Thanks, again.
Regards
Milind Khadilkar
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