-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Wednesday 21 April 2004 11:53, Andre Meyer is believed to have said:
Well, Maik has more than a bad day. In fact, he is rather right about the points he raises!
I have been developing for Zope for about half a year now and it took considerable effort to get anything going. I have experience with filesystem-based Zope 2 products, Plone and Archteypes and a bit of Zope 3. While Z3 looks promising it is not likely to just take over Z2. It is too much different. The biggest problem, however is the lack of (any useful) documentation and sample code. Without the help of the mailing lists you cannot get far with Zope.
I don't agree. I am new to zope. So I tried zope2 first, because plone had a lot of appeal. I got discouraged very quickly, because zope2 is so very grown over a time it's hard to join later. Zope3 seemed quite well documented and I had no problems going on on my own. ( There is a tutorial, a cookbook, and an online apidoc ) I can say nothing however to migrating apps from zope2 to zope3.
With respect to CMS, Plone archetypes are too simplistic for complex data/document types and customisation takes too much effort.
Do not get me wrong! I decided to use Zope because it fits my bill and I am willing to invest more time in Python/Zope/Plone, because I like it a lot (*). But be aware of J2EE/.Net, especially after the Sun/M$ agreement. I have been a Java developer for years and I know that there are a lot of (commercial) parties to develop whatever anyone needs, if you pay them. The same must be true of .Net.
Right, I am developing Java applications for a living as well. I have been focused on consultancy work recently ( writing tech-specifications and projectmanaging for a really big publishing company ) and I think Zope / python has a good potential for use in commercial apps/systems. I have had to work with some premium CMSes and some of them really suck. I'd swap it gladly.
A good IDE for Python/Zope with support for application patterns, UML, etc. would be a good thing. Real application development is a serious business and good tools are essential, just like deadlines and milestones for new releases and up-to-date documentation. I am currently using Eclipse with PyDev, but it has a long way to go until it offers the wealth of support that Eclipse offers for Java. Boa Constructor is a good try, too.
I tried Eclipse, but its so slow.
This is meant to encourage everybody, I am an optimist ;-) Beware of the pragmatic commercial developers.
As to be pragmatic: It is easier and faster to write a functionality in python than in java and thus cheaper. I say : beware of the Marketing. We had to migrate a banking system from a corba/c++ system to J2EE during the last phase of the project, because the customer had heard of 'this J thing everyone is using'.
(*) fyi http://zope.org/Members/drapmeyer/spyse
Chris Withers wrote:
Martin Kretschmar wrote:
Maik Jablonski of the german speaking Zope Users Group DZUG issued a pretty bleak outlook for the future of Zope. What are your oppinions?
Maik's having a bad day, he'll get over it ;-)
Chris
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