Hanno Schlichting wrote:
On Mon, Dec 28, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Martijn Faassen <faassen@startifact.com> wrote:
Hanno Schlichting wrote:
The ZTK no longer contains any zope.app packages. I think we should be careful to just remove the zope.app packages from the ZTK entirely. I.e. we should maintain the versions of the zope.app.* packages that were in Zope 3.4 (or at least the original Zope 3 tree) in the ZTK for the time being. Otherwise we make people's life rather difficult.
I disagree. In my opinion it's not part of the job of the ZTK to provide backwards compatibility with Zope 3. The toolkit is not a replacement for all of Zope 3 and you cannot run a Zope 3 application even after following all the refactorings on the toolkit alone. If users of Zope 3 want an upgrade story, they need to get together and make a new Zope 3 release which is based on the ZTK.
Totally ignoring our community's responsibility towards backwards compatibility and delegating it to a mythical set of "Zope 3 maintainers" isn't an option at all. We need to provide an upgrade path from pre-ZTK applications to ZTK applications. This upgrade path can take the form of a set of versions of zope.app.* libraries that people can choose to install for backwards compatibility. We should maintain this set of versions as part of the ZTK's test regime at the very least, otherwise we'll inevitably break something.
For Zope2 we have covered the upgrade story already. Zope 2.12 uses its own KGS, which includes the entire set of zope.app packages in compatible versions.
Let's please please please maintain that set of zope.app.* packages centrally. Zope 2 isn't the only consumer of these packages.
On a more practical note, it's actually just not helpful to include version pins for any zope.app packages in the ztk.cfg. I can add any arbitrary set of version definitions there. Then run the test-ztk tests and all tests will always pass. Since the packages under tests don't include nor depend on any zope.app packages, their test result is independent of any zope.app version pins.
Then we certainly need to do more than version pins. We also need to test these packages. -1 to this change. I'm going to add the zope.app.* packages back to the ZTK until we've had a proper discussion about how, as a Zope community, we go forward with this. Delegating this responsibility *separately* to sub projects is just plain silly. Regards, Martijn