Well, if anyone was curious I found the problem that was causing my application object to disapear. Acutally Skip, your the one who posted this problem that made me figure it out (with a big DUH!) In the near past before Zope I tried out BoboPOS, but instead of reading the package docs and figuring that out I just dumped all the files into my /lib/python1.5/ dir. Now, when my programs import the Persistent class the *old* way (the new way way, of course, for me to discover later) import Persistence it loaded the old Persistence class, instead of the *new* one which is properly loaded import BoboPOS.Persistence this is why I was getting __class__ name errors in the TJar.py component. Obviously the older objects don't work with the new long running transactions that TJar gives us. This is a subtle error, if your custom objects give the above error, you are using an old version of the Persistence.Persistent class with the new version of the POS. Is there a way this can be made to fail quite obviously? Michel