Sure Chris... The product is a mixed DTML/Python thing with base classes in Python. The usual instantation is via the ZMI where you create a instance of the Zclass, then on a separate tab, copy in the code which does the high level interface. I want to create instances programmatically--that is, I have a form which allows my users to create a discussion thread. I'd thought that I could simply simulate the ZMI mechanisms in Python or DTML, This fails both when accessed expicitly and when accessed using the through-the-web interface. I suspect protections but have not found the right ones to toggle. Non of the literature I have at hand talks much about instantiating ZClasses from programs... Had I a bit more time, I'd redo the whole system as a Python Product but there's no time for such. Any help you can give would be appreciated.