Thanks Tom and Tino. I do believe that Zope and Python is a fantastic combination for building web based applications and systems. I agree that a new way of thinking is required to go to a complete OO web development mentality. I found myself taking 2 hours to figure out to RE-CONSTRUCT a folder to store IMAGES and then give pages outside that FOLDER access to them for display... Typical images folder you see with sites... This alone - when you have zo-db behind you doesnt make sense to structure your applications the same old way. Everything is an object - everything stands on its own. Then its just a matter of structuring your directories for complete productivity purposes at higher/broader level or keeping things really flat. ASP - leaves you limited to how you can approach a problem. Its easier to learn because of this. But, in the end makes for very UN-ELO-QUENT solutions. Zope is more impressive in terms of not just focusing on mundane things, but really going behind 2 or 3 core objects and making the web application world really open up! I like that phrase - 'developement "the zope way"' - would look good on a tee-shirt? Has anyone put any effort into a resource that documents the bullet points of what that means - developement "the zope way"? I would be willing to do so - to really point out to other developers (ASP etc.) Why Zope rocks and __blank__ doesnt! We could fairly deep into it - not just high level reasons why its better... Just a thought. The thing I find the clunkiest (though it works flawlessly and makes good intuitive sense) is the management interface. Would be better as a rich gui. This work is going on isnt it already? Thanks David Kovach dave@kovach.com SAP
From: "Tom Cameron" <tom@cameron.to> Reply-To: <tom@cameron.to> To: "Tino Wildenhain" <tino@wildenhain.de>, <dave@kovach.com>, <zope@zope.org> Subject: RE: [Zope] asp request and response objects Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 21:53:33 +1000
Hi There, I am a newbie at this too. I have moved from ASP to Zope in the last year. It was a good move, but not a simple one.
I found the hardest thing to grasp at first was the name space structure. Acquisition was also difficult - the basic concept is quite simple, but the finer details or how it behaves takes some getting used to.
Tino is right, don't try to look for parallels too much. Concentrate on grasping a completely new concept and look for its strengths.
As for REQUEST and RESPONSE, the same objects exist in zope with slightly different functionality (and different syntax obviously).
Stick at it, python is a very nice, straight forward language and combined with Zope it provides very powerful web publishing solution.
Good luck.
Tom Cameron.
=> -----Original Message----- => From: zope-admin@zope.org [mailto:zope-admin@zope.org]On Behalf Of Tino => Wildenhain => Sent: Tuesday, 24 April 2001 7:49 PM => To: dave@kovach.com; zope@zope.org => Subject: Re: [Zope] asp request and response objects => => => Hi David, => => its hard to give you step-by-step advice how to go from => ASP to zope in a simple mail. => The first helpful thing is to get the hands on python. => Its not really hard. (You could even used python with => win32 extensions with ASP already ;) => => The next thing is to forget all - I mean all of the prevoius => code. Try to figure out how your site/application is meant to => work. What should happen when and where are the data (RDBMS => and such) => Then look whats common in tasks and presentation. If you are so far => you can go for implementation. => => If well thought, developement "the zope way" gives you very rapide => the results you want. Dont try to make a 1:1 transformation from => ASP to Zope. => => Things to look at: => => ZClasses, => ZSQL-Methods, => ZPatterns (yes, very hard to learn, but very very powerful!) => => Object-oriented developement in general. => => However, the 1:1 approach could work. But its by far not optimal and => you give away all the advantages zope has. => => HTH => Tino Wildenhain => => => --On Dienstag, 24. April 2001 01:38 -0500 David Kovach => <davidkovach@hotmail.com> wrote: => => > Hi - => > => > Just getting on board with Zope and Python... => > converting over from MS ASP web application => > development AND dont want to invest/waste time => > with JSP or servlets for that matter. => > => > I look forward to seeing how to further work => > with ZOPE with XML/XSLT - page templates cool! => > => > (end of my blah intro!) => > => > Can anyone share with me in simple terms - how => > ZOPE replicates or depracates the ASP object => > of REQUEST and RESPONSE to build dynamic pages?? => > => > And I have read and seem to assume that keeping => > logic to add dynamic content should be kept to => > Python code thats called from a DTML method or => > something??? Set me straight... => > => > Thanks - and I look forward to interacting => > with you all more... => > => > Sincerely, => > => > David Kovach => > dave@kovach.com => > dave.kovach@sap.com => > => > => > _________________________________________________________________ => > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com => > => > => > _______________________________________________ => > Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org => > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope => > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** => > (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce => > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) => => => => => => _______________________________________________ => Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org => http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope => ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** => (Related lists - => http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce => http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) =>
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