In my site I have folder with subfolders and I would like to generate a menu to go to those subfolders. What I have now is: <dtml-in "objectValues()"> <dtml-var sequence-key> </dtml-in> which gives emptynes.. I've tried all kinds of combinations, tricks from the tips and howto's, but nothing. [rh]First, why do you use sequence-key? Use sequence-item instead <dtml-in "objectValues()"> <dtml-var sequence-item> </dtml-in> second Actually I start thinking that zope is not for me. Yes, I'm a programmer, but here and now creating websites. I want to create a website, not publish objects. An abstactionlayer between zope and python would be a good thing. (and don't tell me DTML IS an abstractionlayer. It confuses the matter, it doesn't simplify. Including perl straight into the pages would be simpler. Not to mention that Python is actually decently documented..) [rh]No one will tell you DTML is ideal,. It's meant to be a presentation language and for that it's powerful. If you want to write python inside Zope - use PythonMethods. If you really want to put perl into your webpages - there is PerlMethods coming up, that presumably can do the same as PythonMethods. Anyhow, I'm not giving up yet let's check my mental image: A zope site is an tree of objects, objects inherrit from parents. [rh]Yes, and they acquire from parents. Acquisition is a type of dynamic inheritance (how do I check if a parent exists?) so there should be a way to refere to the parent (PARENTS[]) to refer to the current object (?). [rh]current object is this() for most purposes. I do not quite get what you're aiming at. But the current object depends on the namespace and the namespace is a stack determined by parents, using acquisition. Traversing the namespace changing the current object, and so do dtml tags like dtml-in and dtml-with. The best introduction to these is probably in http://www.zope.org/Documentation/How-To/AdvancedDTML I guess there should also be a way to refer to objects in an other branch of the tree (I would like to have a tools folder which is also searched when asking for a DTML-methode) [rh]This can be accomplished (simply) by using <dtml-with "<yourobject>.<yoursubobject>"> your code </dtml-with> or more directly <dtml-var "<yourfolder>.<theobjectyouwant>()"> But there are many other methods of doing this in more sophisticated ways, depending on your needs Is my mental image to limited? Does it need adjusting? [rh]it may need adjusting in your appreciation of Zope flexibility Rik