You can write horrible Zope apps very quickly and easily, and DTML will let you get away with it. I've seen developers copy folders full of ugly DTML to new folders, change a few things inside a few of the methods in the new folder, and that's how a new menu item is born. I've seen Zope apps with 300 DTML methods, and only 6 python scripts, and those 6 would have been in DTML if it were possible. (Python as a last resort because developer X doesn't want to learn another language) In short, I've seen Zope apps with absolutely no separation between the application and presentation layers. Zope, and more specifically DTML, is flexible enough to let you do this. Just because you CAN create a working prototype of an application using a mixture of DTML and HTML during what should be the design phase of a project, doesn't mean you SHOULD. If you want to hack up a barely working un-manageable mess of DTML in the shortest possible amount of time, and then call it a "production ready" web application after a week of bug chasing, then DTML will help you do this. If you want to create a highly structured, easily maintainable and extensible object oriented web application, and you want to apply one more of the "light" SDLC methodologies to your project, then ZPT is your best friend. There's nothing better than completed GUI templates for helping to test your understanding of the requirements and use cases. Your users will gladly contribute to this process. Just my two cents :-) Adam