I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!! Before I go further with this, I have some questions... 1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client? 2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates. In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used? 3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client? What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build? Thanks again. Lovin' Zope so far! On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 12:04:51 -0500, Alan Snyder <alan8373@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!!
Before I go further with this, I have some questions...
1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client? 2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates. In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used? 3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client? What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
Thanks again.
Lovin' Zope so far!
On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 17:40:28 +0100, bruno modulix <bruno@modulix.org> wrote:
Alan Snyder wrote:
Ok - I think I'll play with Zope 2 - I have a book on it and can flip through that. I'll play with the base Zope packages first and then hop onto Plone. I love the layout and look and feel of Plone and I'm curious about the visuals of naked zope.
'naked' Zope doesn't have much visuals - unless you're talking about the ZMI !-)
There's no better way to find out than to play so I'm hopefully able to dedicate today to that task.
Have fun, and don't despair : beginning with Zope is known to be somewhat difficult, but the reward is worth the time invested.
Bruno --
Bruno Desthuilliers - Analyste-programmeur bruno@modulix.org www.modulix.com
Alan Snyder wrote:
I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!!
Before I go further with this, I have some questions...
1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client?
Zope has some webdav support but I never tried to use it. There are also file-system based components that you can manage like any other file. And there's ZopeExternalEditor that let you edit (some) Zope objects with a local editor (needs some install on the client). When it comes to Products and External Methods, they are FS based. I've also written some 'upload files and update datas' scripts for Zope, and that works quite fine - just need to know a bit of Zope's internals. And finally, anything you do TTW can be done programmaticaly as long as you can connect to your server. Search zope.org for zope debugging, zope unit-testing and ZEO, you'll find some usefull informations (but first learn a bit more about Zope architecture, the ZODB etc).
2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates. In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used?
depends on how you access the template, but if you use context acquisition (ie : access object with 'here/my_object_id' (tales path expression) or 'context.my_object_id' (python), just put a different template with the same name in the sub-folder and you're done. The acquisition mechanism is one of Zope's greatest difficulty *and* strength.
3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"?
Yes.
Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful.
zope.org is good place to start. Some of my favorites are EpozDocument, mxmRelation and Reference, but there are many other pretty useful things. When it comes to developping with Zope, forget about dtml and zclasses and go for PageTemplates and Products.
Also - how hard are they to install at a client?
untar the tarball in the Product directory, restart Zope and you're done (unless there are some bugs or missing dependencies...)
What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
I'll leave this to other - since we hosts our Zope applications, I never thought of deployment issues. -- Bruno Desthuilliers - Analyste-programmeur bruno@modulix.org www.modulix.com
On Thu, Dec 02, 2004 at 12:05:09PM -0500, Alan Snyder wrote:
I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!!
I remember that feeling, so many years ago :-)
Before I go further with this, I have some questions...
1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client?
There are a couple ways... If you are attached to working in the Zope Management INterface (ZMI) and storing your code and templates in the ZODB, you can use ZSyncer (zsyncer.sf.net) to copy live objects from one running zope to another. However, this is just data transfer, it is NOT a substitute for a revision control system. To leverage your existing development tools, including CVS/SVN/whatever, I highly recommend reading this: http://plope.com/Members/chrism/zope_collab/view?searchterm=collaborative ... including the comments which have good points about maintenance after deployment.
2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates.
yes.
In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used?
The former. the magic of acquisition means that you look in the immediate container first, then its parent, all the way back up to the root. (and then in any other stuff in context, but that's an advanced topic.)
3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client?
For Products defined in fileystem code, typically all you have to do is give your client a zip or tarball of one folder, which they unpack place into $INSTANCE_HOME/Products, restart Zope, and they're done.
What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
If your Product needs to do more than just register itself as startup - e.g. you want the client to end up with one or more instances of this product and maybe do some configuration of other objects in the zodb - that can be scripted. This is common with "Tools" for CMF (and its descendants like Plone and CPS), which typically need to be installed into a particular CMF instance and do some configuration on it. To do this, the tool author usually provides an Extensions/Install.py "external method". All the user has to do is go into their CMF/Plone/CPS/whatever instance, add an External Method with a module name of NameOfTheTool.Install and a function name of "install". Click Test and everything in your install function gets done. I guess the "canonical" example of this is CMFCalendar, which comes with CMFDefault. You could also look at my CMFBoringTool example code which you can download from zope.org. Another possibility, if you want to give your clients a bunch of ready-made objects is to create them in your own zope in a folder, export that folder, and send the clients the resulting .zexp file. Personally I'd prefer to have my install code generate everything needed instead so i can keep it under revision control. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com
On Thu, Dec 02, 2004 at 12:05:09PM -0500, Alan Snyder wrote: [snip]
3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client? What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
Right. They're Products. Most (all?) are implemented in Python. You can find their implementations in the following locations: - Under your Zope installation directory: Zope-2.7/lib/python - Under your instance directory, for example: MyInstance/Products If you have not yet installed any products, then MyInstance/Products will be (mostly) empty. And, that's where you will unroll a product when you want to install it. Dave -- Dave Kuhlman http://www.rexx.com/~dkuhlman
On Thursday 02 December 2004 18:05, Alan Snyder wrote:
I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!!
Before I go further with this, I have some questions...
1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client?
Yes, there is a nifty synchronization product, which once installed on 2 zope instances, will show you a diff, and synchronize them for you! Search zope.org products section for synch...
2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates. In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used?
That is one of the main purposes of the whole thingy! Now you got the Idea!
3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client? What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
They are prodcuts, usually installation consists of copying an additional directory to the products directory, and restarting zope. Some products are a little more complex (require special python packages, or linux/windows dlls) You can find most on zope.org download zope products section. You rest you have to google for! I suggest you look into zetadb, it sounds like it might be usefull to you! Jerry
Thanks again.
Lovin' Zope so far!
On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 12:04:51 -0500, Alan Snyder <alan8373@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm in love with zope from what i've seen of this Elvis Sightings interactive demo. It's so friggin' easy to build functionalities into pages. Holy smokes!!
Before I go further with this, I have some questions...
1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update? Is it a matter of just copying files and such from a folder (like the parent elvis sightings folder), or do i need to grab stuff from different zope config areas and work it. Bottom line - is there any synchronization or update mechanisms available that let me develop and fix sites locally and effect those changes on a remote server, i.e. at a client? 2) I saw in one of the chapters that each page can reference a template (like standard_template.something)... This looks really cool for giving a similar layout to pages in a "folder". Can sub-folder templates "over-ride" parent folder templates. In other words, if i copy the "standard_template" file to a sub folder and slightly modify it will that version be picked up by those folder's pages, or will the parent version be used? 3) What are the items in that drop down list of things in the upper right corner of every folder called? It has stuff like "DTML Document, Mai Host..." Are those "products"? Where can I find more of those. They're wonderful. Also - how hard are they to install at a client? What mechanisms are available for producing "install scripts" for clients who want to use the stuff I build?
Thanks again.
Lovin' Zope so far!
On Thu, 02 Dec 2004 17:40:28 +0100, bruno modulix <bruno@modulix.org> wrote:
Alan Snyder wrote:
Ok - I think I'll play with Zope 2 - I have a book on it and can flip through that. I'll play with the base Zope packages first and then hop onto Plone. I love the layout and look and feel of Plone and I'm curious about the visuals of naked zope.
'naked' Zope doesn't have much visuals - unless you're talking about the ZMI !-)
There's no better way to find out than to play so I'm hopefully able to dedicate today to that task.
Have fun, and don't despair : beginning with Zope is known to be somewhat difficult, but the reward is worth the time invested.
Bruno --
Bruno Desthuilliers - Analyste-programmeur bruno@modulix.org www.modulix.com
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Alan Snyder wrote at 2004-12-2 12:05 -0500:
... 1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update?
When you use the CMF (or Plone which is build on top of CMF), then there is the "Filesystem Directory View". As its name suggests, it makes the content of a directory in the file system available as Zope objects. We use it heavily to have all our infrastructure (templates, logic) in the filesystem, managed via CVS/SVN. The CMF comes with other nice utilities as well: we make especially heavy use of the "ActionsTool" and the "SkinsTool". You will like them, once you get acquainted... -- Dieter
I installed plone yesterday and i'm plugging away at it. It's confusing, like zope is, but powerful. Can anyone recommend a good zope and/or plone book? Separate books are fine with me if one doesn't do the job. On Fri, 3 Dec 2004 20:34:14 +0100, Dieter Maurer <dieter@handshake.de> wrote:
Alan Snyder wrote at 2004-12-2 12:05 -0500:
... 1) I am creating all of these pages through the zope manager interface which is great, but is it possible, and if so how, to do what I'm doing here and update a client remotely through something like a CVS or some pre-packaged zope update?
When you use the CMF (or Plone which is build on top of CMF), then there is the "Filesystem Directory View". As its name suggests, it makes the content of a directory in the file system available as Zope objects.
We use it heavily to have all our infrastructure (templates, logic) in the filesystem, managed via CVS/SVN.
The CMF comes with other nice utilities as well: we make especially heavy use of the "ActionsTool" and the "SkinsTool".
You will like them, once you get acquainted...
-- Dieter
On Fri, Dec 03, 2004 at 02:58:14PM -0500, Alan Snyder wrote:
I installed plone yesterday and i'm plugging away at it. It's confusing, like zope is, but powerful. Can anyone recommend a good zope and/or plone book? Separate books are fine with me if one doesn't do the job.
Andy McKays' "The Definitive Guide to Plone" and "The Zope Book" (online 2.7 edition in progress, at http://www.plope.com/Books/2_7Edition for now. -- Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com
kewl. thanks On Fri, 3 Dec 2004 15:02:34 -0500, Paul Winkler <pw_lists@slinkp.com> wrote:
On Fri, Dec 03, 2004 at 02:58:14PM -0500, Alan Snyder wrote:
I installed plone yesterday and i'm plugging away at it. It's confusing, like zope is, but powerful. Can anyone recommend a good zope and/or plone book? Separate books are fine with me if one doesn't do the job.
Andy McKays' "The Definitive Guide to Plone" and "The Zope Book" (online 2.7 edition in progress, at http://www.plope.com/Books/2_7Edition for now.
--
Paul Winkler http://www.slinkp.com _______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
participants (6)
-
Alan Snyder -
bruno modulix -
Dave Kuhlman -
Dieter Maurer -
Jerry Westrick -
Paul Winkler