For those interested in workflow systems and workflow within Zope, the following workflow system may be useful to try out. It models workflow steps explicitly and a workflow becomes a graph with a visual editor. I have been meaning to send along some resources in this area I have been accumulating. The Endeavors group at UCI developed this and the peer-to-peer system they built, Magi, is now at www.endtech.com as open source. They are still developing the workflow product but an early prototype you can download and play with is at: http://www.ics.uci.edu/pub/endeavors/endeavors.html See also the papers and the web-based workflow thesis at: http://www.ics.uci.edu/pub/endeavors/docs/papers/ There was discussion of graphical system to present workflow. I have looked at several, including the At&T stuff. When I have time, I will send a separate email with some that I have found. One thing to look at which is ActiveX based at the moment is http://www.lassalle.com/ A general purpose Flowcharting/Diagramming ActiveX control. I am very interested in a general, fairly full featured workflow system on top of Zope as opposed to using an external workflow product for a fundamental reason. While one could come up with a way of getting what I need with an external system, it would be messy. I need workflows to be explicit and versioned. We make use of ZODB to version content that end users generate. We don't make use of Zope's versioning but use or own hierarchical version tree which is easy to do in Zope. End users generate new workflows and revisit past workflows. The user sees this versioning as notebook pages using a scientific notebook metaphor. It is much cleaner to use ZODB and ZPublisher to do all this instead of having a version tree in Zope and a bunch of correspondences to outside objects in an external workflow system. Thus, there is a lot of value in having a fairly general workflow system whose representation and publishing uses ZODB and ZPublisher. There seems to be a principle here on how to layer systems correctly on top of ZODB and ZPublisher or any persistant-object web publishing system. One way is very clean and simple and other ways are nightmares. Regards, Albert Boulanger aboulanger@vpatch.com