Hi I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris? What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ). Thanx Oliver Erlewein (erlewein@gmx.de) -- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net -- GMX Tipp: Machen Sie Ihr Hobby zu Geld bei unserem Partner 1&1! http://profiseller.de/info/index.php3?ac=OM.PS.PS003K00596T0409a
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Oliver Erlewein wrote:
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
AFAIK it's only a problem under Linux with an ext2 filesystem on 32 bits architecture. you can use Linux with ReiserFS instead to solve the problem. however Solaris should be fine. bye, Jerome Alet
Hi Oliver, interesting article at: http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm which (in part) addresses your questions. i quote: "Our benchmarks demonstrate a 12x performance difference between process-based and asynchronous task architectures. Significantly, we found up to a 75% overall performance difference between OSes when using the most efficient asynchronous architecture. We found Linux to be the best performing operating system based on our metrics, performing 35% better than Solaris, which came in second, followed by Windows, and finally, FreeBSD." the 2GB file size limit is not an OS limit on linux: it is a limit on the Ext2 file system. several journalling file systems for linux offer max. file sizes beyond 2GB (at least in theory). check out reiserfs, xfs etc. i owuld be curious to know if anyone is running a production server with one of these filesystems. also, file storage for ZODB is not the only option: there are alternative storages available which could help to get round file size contraints: check out oracle storage/berekely storage for this. On 18 Jun 2001, at 13:02, Oliver Erlewein wrote: From: Oliver Erlewein <erlewein@gmx.de> To: zope@zope.org Subject: [Zope] 2GB Limit & Best Zope Platform Date sent: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:02:22 +0200 (MEST)
Hi
I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris?
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
Thanx Oliver Erlewein (erlewein@gmx.de)
-- GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet. http://www.gmx.net
-- GMX Tipp:
Machen Sie Ihr Hobby zu Geld bei unserem Partner 1&1! http://profiseller.de/info/index.php3?ac=OM.PS.PS003K00596T0409a
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+-------------------------------------------+ Garry Steedman mailto:gs@styrax.com Styrax Associates http://www.styrax.com/ "The Good Man has no shape." +-------------------------------------------+
On Mon, Jun 18, 2001 at 01:14:03PM +0000, Garry Steedman wrote:
the 2GB file size limit is not an OS limit on linux: it is a limit on the Ext2 file system. several journalling file systems for linux offer max. file sizes beyond 2GB (at least in theory). check out reiserfs, xfs etc.
It is not a limitation of ext2, but a limitation of the VFS layer in the 2.2 kernels. The 2.4 series fixes this. -- Petru Paler, mailto:ppetru@ppetru.net http://www.ppetru.net - ICQ: 41817235
i owuld be curious to know if anyone is running a production server with one of these filesystems.
At iuveno everything runs on SuSE Linux with ReiserFS. No problems so far. Couldn't even test whether we get faster server reboots after crashes because we haven't had a crash yet ;-) Joachim
On 18 Jun 2001 13:14:03 +0000, Garry Steedman wrote:
Hi Oliver,
interesting article at:
http://www.sysadminmag.com/articles/2001/0107/0107a/0107a.htm
which (in part) addresses your questions. i quote:
"Our benchmarks demonstrate a 12x performance difference between process-based and asynchronous task architectures. Significantly, we found up to a 75% overall performance difference between OSes when using the most efficient asynchronous architecture. We found Linux to be the best performing operating system based on our metrics, performing 35% better than Solaris, which came in second, followed by Windows, and finally, FreeBSD."
the 2GB file size limit is not an OS limit on linux: it is a limit on the Ext2 file system. several journalling file systems for linux offer max. file sizes beyond 2GB (at least in theory). check out reiserfs, xfs etc.
*sigh* The 2Gb file size limit was a problem with the Linux kernel 2.2 and below VFS. it is NOT a limit of a particular filesystem. XFS Rocks. I have a number of production and file system stress machines running it at work (where I do heavy Filesystem testin on Linux a spart of my job). ReiserFS is fine to, though between XFS and ResierFS for a Data.fs 9hehe) I would choose XFS. On a 32bit intel system, using XFS, you won't have to worry about siz elimitations until your filesize is ~16 terabytes. someting tells me you will have other things to worry about long before that. JFS for Linux is not ready for prime time. Ext2 on kenrel >= 2.4.0 will be fine (otehr than long fsck times when that happens). File size ther eis likewise in the terabyte range. For performance, I would recommend XFS on Linux v2.45 or higher (preferable 6 when it comes out, there will be an important patch i expect to be in) To give a rough idea of filesystem performance of XFS (BTw, this is the only journalling filesystem for Linux that is past the beta stage): Format a 13.7 GB partition: .133 seconds (yes, the decimal is in the right place!) Fill it with a single DD command until filesystem full: 18.9 minutes Above with 4 paralell dd commands: 10 minutes Delete files that fil up said 13.7 Gb partition: 1.2 seconds. There is no 'in theory' involved with suprassing a 2Gb filesize on Linux kernel version >= 2.4. It works. I've verified it. Repeatedly. In fact, tomorrow I shall be doing multiple terabyte sized files. Again. There are other, far more important, things to consider than this, when choosing a platform four your zope. Bill
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:02:22 +0200 (MEST), you wrote:
Hi
I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris?
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
The file size limit on NT is 4 TB (since NT 3.51 I think) -- __________________________________________________ "Nothing is as subjective as reality" Reinoud van Leeuwen reinoud@xs4all.nl http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud __________________________________________________
I have expirienced 2GB problems on W2K machines with Zope 2.2.2 using the binary package from zope.org. I don't know if the problem is still there in later versions, but it is definately there in 2.2.2. I have some very pleasant expiriences with Zope on both Solaris and Linux (well on Windows too but that doesn't count :-) Martin Skøtt mskott@image.dk On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:02:22 +0200 (MEST), you wrote:
Hi
I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris?
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
The file size limit on NT is 4 TB (since NT 3.51 I think)
-- __________________________________________________ "Nothing is as subjective as reality" Reinoud van Leeuwen reinoud@xs4all.nl http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud __________________________________________________
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
The problem with file size is not in Zope, but something to do with Windows using a 32 bit integer for file size, pegging the limit at 2 gigs. Im not sure how some people solve this, but its a deep python / windows problem that will not be solved any day soon. Cheers. -- Andy McKay. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martin Skøtt" <mskott@image.dk> To: "Reinoud van Leeuwen" <reinoud@xs4all.nl> Cc: <zope@zope.org> Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2001 12:10 PM Subject: Re: [Zope] 2GB Limit & Best Zope Platform
I have expirienced 2GB problems on W2K machines with Zope 2.2.2 using the binary package from zope.org. I don't know if the problem is still there in later versions, but it is definately there in 2.2.2. I have some very pleasant expiriences with Zope on both Solaris and Linux (well on Windows too but that doesn't count :-)
Martin Skøtt mskott@image.dk
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:02:22 +0200 (MEST), you wrote:
Hi
I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris?
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
The file size limit on NT is 4 TB (since NT 3.51 I think)
-- __________________________________________________ "Nothing is as subjective as reality" Reinoud van Leeuwen reinoud@xs4all.nl http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud __________________________________________________
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
http://www.zope.org/Members/hathawsh/PartitionedFileStorage
From: "Andy McKay" <andym@ActiveState.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 13:41:27 -0700 To: Martin Skøtt <mskott@image.dk>, "Reinoud van Leeuwen" <reinoud@xs4all.nl> Cc: <zope@zope.org> Subject: Re: [Zope] 2GB Limit & Best Zope Platform
The problem with file size is not in Zope, but something to do with Windows using a 32 bit integer for file size, pegging the limit at 2 gigs. Im not sure how some people solve this, but its a deep python / windows problem that will not be solved any day soon.
Cheers. -- Andy McKay.
That looks very much like the way the problem was solved. I only found the problem somebody else took the battle of solving it :-) Martin Skøtt mskott@image.dk On Wed, 20 Jun 2001, marc lindahl wrote:
http://www.zope.org/Members/hathawsh/PartitionedFileStorage
From: "Andy McKay" <andym@ActiveState.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 13:41:27 -0700 To: Martin Skøtt <mskott@image.dk>, "Reinoud van Leeuwen" <reinoud@xs4all.nl> Cc: <zope@zope.org> Subject: Re: [Zope] 2GB Limit & Best Zope Platform
The problem with file size is not in Zope, but something to do with Windows using a 32 bit integer for file size, pegging the limit at 2 gigs. Im not sure how some people solve this, but its a deep python / windows problem that will not be solved any day soon.
Cheers. -- Andy McKay.
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
On Wed, 20 Jun 2001 21:10:40 +0200 (CEST), you wrote:
I have expirienced 2GB problems on W2K machines with Zope 2.2.2 using the binary package from zope.org. I don't know if the problem is still there in later versions, but it is definately there in 2.2.2. I have some very pleasant expiriences with Zope on both Solaris and Linux (well on Windows too but that doesn't count :-)
Well I am sorry that you have problems. (My Zope is running nicely on FreeBSD by the way), but the 2 Gb is not a *windows NT NTFS* problem. It might be in the Windows port of Zope or in a general Zope piece. But NTFS files *can* be 4 TB
Martin Skøtt mskott@image.dk
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:02:22 +0200 (MEST), you wrote:
Hi
I'm piloting Zope for our company on a small Intel WS running under Widows NT (4.0 & Zope 2.3.2). Now I have to prepare the production server (medium sized, ~500Users, ~25 concurrent users). My question is, which server/OS is the best to use. Our provider is inclined that we use an Sun / Solaris server. Is there a reason not to use Sun/Solaris?
What about the 2Gb filesize limitation on some OS? Does that apply to NT / Solaris / Linux /FreeBSD (or is that problem solved with Zope 2.4.x ? ;-) ).
The file size limit on NT is 4 TB (since NT 3.51 I think)
-- __________________________________________________ "Nothing is as subjective as reality" Reinoud van Leeuwen reinoud@xs4all.nl http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud __________________________________________________
_______________________________________________ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
-- __________________________________________________ "Nothing is as subjective as reality" Reinoud van Leeuwen reinoud@xs4all.nl http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud __________________________________________________
participants (10)
-
Andy McKay -
Bill Anderson -
Garry Steedman -
Jerome Alet -
Joachim Werner -
marc lindahl -
Martin Skøtt -
Oliver Erlewein -
ppetru＠ppetru.net -
reinoud＠xs4all.nl