Hi all, thought I'd share this 'insight' - I could be wrong here though, so YMMV...

I saw Loren Staffords' "Breadcrumbs How-to" at the new Zope community site, http://www.zope.org/Members/lstaffor/Breadcrumbs

and realised that DTML methods are meant to be used as 'fragments' of a document, whilst DTML documents 'pull everything together' into a coherent web page.

That's a very good way to put it. The (perhaps not very clear) way that we've tried to explain this is that: o a DTML Document is *content*, and its context (its idea of 'self') is itself. o DTML Methods are *methods* that operate on their container. A DTML Method's idea of 'self' is its container. So a DTML Document is logically a "content" object, that may use DTML Methods or other objects to build itself using elements of the environment where it lives.

If I'm right, I think that the default DTML you get when you create a DTML method isn't that apt. I don't think that it should include the standard_html_header and _footer variables, as it's a bit misleading.

That's a good point. The default DTML for DTML Methods is leftover from before DTML objects were split to make the distinction between content and method objects. What do you think would be good default content for a DTML Method? I suppose one answer is that it should just be empty, but I think that it's easier for those new to Zope when they see *some* kind of default rather than being presented with a totally blank slate and no direction at all. In any case, could you post this concern to the Collector to make sure that it doesn't speed off in the current of list traffic? Brian Lloyd brian@digicool.com Software Engineer 540.371.6909 Digital Creations http://www.digicool.com