Re: [Zope] Reality check PYZOMA = python / zope for Mac ?
Jason Cunliffe writes:
Is the mac getting left behind or will the new MacOSX in fact bring Python adn Zope more easily into the fold? MacOSX is almost Unix.
It should be easy to create Python and Zope on it. Dieter
Dieter Maurer <dieter@handshake.de> wrote:
Is the mac getting left behind or will the new MacOSX in fact bring Python adn Zope more easily into the fold? MacOSX is almost Unix.
It should be easy to create Python and Zope on it.
That's good news, assuming that Mac owners uniformly adopt MacOSX. I would love to here from anyone interested who has MacOSX and would be willing to test this out. Does anyone know what Apple's plans are for MacOSX introduction to broad mass market.? Will it be the default AppleOS by end of 2001? I imagine though that most existing Mac users, artists, etc, especially long term users will not be in much of a hurry to upgrade at all unless they are technology freaks or have compelling new tools to benefit from. This makes me suspect there will be a large current Mac User population likely to be left behind by as we go into the next year with Python 2.x++ and Zope 2.3x++ being the modern versions. Will Zope 2.3x run on Python 1.5.2 - yes/no/maybe/sometimes/depends? My concern is because I want to install an integrated application using Zope + [Python] + Browser + Flash5 and I want it to run on Mac, Win32, Linux [etc]. Local ZServer + Flash5 offering peer-peer + smart-client features which can work offline and online adn be easy for desktop drag and drop for group site creation and management. Local Zope is a key part of this strategy - I have been recently discussing Zope based project with some artists, and was reminded about how many creative people only use Macs, thus the ZMac question. Thanks - Jason ___________________________________________________________ Jason CUNLIFFE = NOMADICS['Interactive Art and Technology']
Hi Jason, Have you seen: http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXBHFS Zope-2.3a1 runs with Python-1.5.2. I've run Zope-2.2.x on MacOSX and it runs great. At some point someone with time, or a paying customer, or both will get an Open Database (MySQL, PostegreSQL, ... ) running on MacOSX and we'll have a full fledged solution. There is already a commercial outfit selling MySQL stuff for MacOSX, so it's just a matter of time. ;-) It will be interesting to see how Apple handles moving millions of MacOS users to what is really a fundamentally different operating system with unix under the hood.... but that's for a different mailing list. ;-) -steve
Steve Thanks very much for this encouraging news. Indeed if it runs well, Zope could be important enough app for for soem people to upgrade to MacOSX. If one needs to install Zope __now__ on non-MacOSX machines, what is the story? cheers - Jason ___________________________________________________________ Jason CUNLIFFE = NOMADICS['Interactive Art and Technology'] Steve Spicklemire <steve@spvi.com> wrote:
Have you seen: http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXBHFS
Zope-2.3a1 runs with Python-1.5.2. I've run Zope-2.2.x on MacOSX and it runs great. At some point someone with time, or a paying customer, ...[snip mySQL commercial/non-commercial prospects]
Hi Jason, As far as I know there are only two ways to run Zope on MacOS7/8/9. 1) run Virtual PC and use the Windows version. 2) run Virtual PC and use the Linux version. sorry. -steve
"Jason" == Jason Cunliffe <jasonic@nomadicsltd.com> writes:
Jason> Steve Jason> Thanks very much for this encouraging news. Indeed if it Jason> runs well, Zope could be important enough app for for soem Jason> people to upgrade to MacOSX. Jason> If one needs to install Zope __now__ on non-MacOSX Jason> machines, what is the story? Jason> cheers - Jason Jason> ___________________________________________________________ Jason> Jason CUNLIFFE = NOMADICS['Interactive Art and Technology'] Jason> Steve Spicklemire <steve@spvi.com> wrote: >> Have you seen: http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXBHFS >> >> Zope-2.3a1 runs with Python-1.5.2. I've run Zope-2.2.x on >> MacOSX and it runs great. At some point someone with time, or a >> paying customer, Jason> ...[snip mySQL commercial/non-commercial prospects]
Does anyone know what Apple's plans are for MacOSX introduction to broad mass market.? Will it be the default AppleOS by end of 2001?
Zope-2.3a1 runs with Python-1.5.2. I've run Zope-2.2.x on MacOSX and it runs great. At some point someone with time, or a paying customer, or both will get an Open Database (MySQL, PostegreSQL, ... ) running on MacOSX and we'll have a full fledged solution.
If one needs to install Zope __now__ on non-MacOSX machines, what is the story?
Zope apparently has some problems with Python 2.0 and requires Python 1.5.2 to run correctly. 1.5.2 is not multithreaded under the classic Mac OS and thus will not support Zope. (2.0 is multithreaded on the Mac, but doesn't work with Zope, though whether this is due only to the Python version or also includes other issues, I don't know). The speculation now is that OSX will be announced in February in proximity with MacWorld Tokyo and become available for purchase around that time. Apple has announced plans to ship OSX on new machines beginning in the summer. As usual, though, it wouldn't be much of a surprise if the dates slipped. There are ongoing issues around the OSX interface. However, it appears that Apple intends to minimize the overlap period between the classic Mac OS and OSX. I'd guess it will be the default OS by the end of 2001, but there will remain a substantial installed base of the classic system for some time. OSX is basically BSD unix with a proprietary presentation layer on top. Disks can be formatted with either a typical unixish case-sensitive file sysem or the Mac HFS+ extended file system, which is case insensitive. Most Mac users would probably choose the latter, which can cause problems with module and directory names when case sensitivity is assumed. I believe this problem affects building both Python and Zope. In addition, some of the standard file paths are different in OSX (e.g., to the java VM) and require a little investigating and editing to get things to work right. I've also heard that the gnu c compiler is named 'cc' rather than 'gcc' and that this can be a problem in some installs. Many things install correctly with no trouble, but it's not unusual to have to tweak a bit. Ultimately these issues will become generally known and things will be less of a guessing game than than are now. Tony Lownds has compiled Python 2.0 for Mac OSX <http://tony.lownds.com/macosx/>, which installs fine. I haven't found a source for a compiled 1.5.2. I've tried to follow Steve's directions for the 1.5.2 build at <http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXBHFS> but I haven't been successful with that as yet. I also tried Zope with Python 2 (above) but wasn't able to get it to build correctly. Incidentally (in response to a previous comment), a compiled binary of MySQL (3.23.27) for MacOSX/Darwin is available at <http://www.mysql.com/downloads/mysql-3.23.html> under "Older and contributed versions." As an aside, OSX has pretty good Java support (JVM 1.2.2) and both JPython <www.jpython.org> and Jython <jython.sourceforge.net> compile and run fine (you must install jython with the '-unix' option because it doesn't recognize MacOSX). I've been experimenting with servlet containers (Tomcat, jakarta.apache.org) with the idea of writing servlets in Jython (example code for these is available). I've also played around with Enhydra <www.enhydra.org> and that also runs fine on OSX. jhh.cbmi.upmc.edu is a MacOSX machine running Tomcat and Jython which will hopefully have some Jython demo servlets up sometime next week. This machine will also get a Zope installation as soon as the OSX issues are worked out. Jim Harrison Univ. of Pittsburgh
"Jim" == Jim Harrison <jhrsn@pitt.edu> writes:
>> Does anyone know what Apple's plans are for MacOSX introduction Jim> haven't found a source for a compiled 1.5.2. I've tried to Jim> follow Steve's directions for the 1.5.2 build at Jim> <http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXBHFS> but I Jim> haven't been successful with that as yet. I also tried Zope Hmm... as an attempt to help with this I've uploaded stuff to http://www.zope.org/Members/sspickle/MacOSXStuff that you can download and install python and Zope on MacOSX. There are minimal instructions there, but all the compiling has been done.... all you should need is to: as root: #make install in the Python-1.5.2 directory, and edit the 'stop' file (which has a hard coded path in it) in the Zope-2.2.4-bin directory once you've unpacked the files with gnutar. Here's what I did: gnutar -xzvf pyth152.b.mosx.tgz su cd Python-1.5.2 make install exit gnutar -xzvf Zope-2.2.4.b.mosx.tgz cd Zope-2.2.4-bin sed s/steve/yourname/g < stop > newstop mv newstop stop ./start Let me know how it goes! -steve
participants (4)
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Dieter Maurer -
Jason Cunliffe -
Jim Harrison -
Steve Spicklemire