[Zope] Why so many problems with database adapters?

[Michel Pelletier]

Tino Wildenhain wrote:
> 
> Hi Hung,
> 
> Hung Jung Lu wrote:
> >
> > But currently the database adapters have problems. I have
> > tried SybaseDAv2 and ZODBC. A few problems have been reported
> > to the Collector with patches. But no actions taken on the
> > part of Digicool, for a long time.
> 
> Are you actually paying for support? If you are so depending on
> the solution, it would be the next logical step to take.
> If not, so we can all hope and wish, but not _demand_ to get the
> fixes :-)
> 

This is a good point, currently on our radar we are putting time into
the Oracle DA and a PCGI bug because of paid support.  I'm having to
suffer through an NT install today for just this reason.

> > Is there another way of loosening the tight control of release
> > of products? If Digicool does not have the man-power for taking
> > care of release of some component, why not figure out a way
> > for others to jump in and do the fixes?

This is absolutly a key issue, but there is so much more to software
development than just being able to check it in.  This works great for
those killer bugs your talking about though, if you have the patch,
great, if you can check it in, better?  How does the community trust the
people who can check in?  Do me have some sort of evaluation period?  I
can think of a dozen people off hand I would trust with write access,
but a few of them I would watch.  How can we watch?  Is there workflow
in CVS?  Doubt it.  Approaching the rat hole at every increasing speed.

Right now people can send a patch to the collector, but it takes us time
time test it and understand it, especially if it's a deep issue.  Other
people need to get ahold of the patch and test it too, we need better
verification from people we trust then just 'works for me' if we can't
invest the time to investigate each patch thorougly.  The community
really needs to do that investigation.  They could probably do it better
anyway.

> > are patches already made by someone. A publicly visible user
> > feedback would also probably accelerate the fixes of products,
> > be they made by Digicool or any outside people. I guess a
> > message bulletin board linked to each individual product gives
> > much better help than letting new users wade through tons of
> > mailing list messages. (Product owners can remove nasty
> > or unappropriate feedback messages, if necessary.)
> 
> Nice idea. This could help a bit.

I vote Wiki.
 
> > On one hand Zope advertises that it has database adapters to
> > most databases, on the other hand we know that these adapters
> > have problems that sit unfixed. Database is critical in most
> > commercial applications, and frankly Digicool is risking
> > a bit when mouthwords come out about the quality of the
> > database adapters and the lack of support.
> 
> There are other companies which distribute software full of bugs and
> low on features and have very good success with it .-)

We want to stay pretty far away from them.

-Michel