Zope May 1999

zope@zope.dev

178 participants
596 discussions

passing REQUEST.form to frames
by Hannu Krosing 09 Dec '99

09 Dec '99

What is the correct syntax for passing form data to child frames of a frameset ? I would like to pass form fields that is submitted to frameset to child frames. Is there any alternative built-in syntax to using an ugly construct like this : =& ------------------ Hannu

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RE: [Zope] To Zope or Not To Zope?
by Paul Everitt 28 Jun '99

28 Jun '99

Ryan wrote: > A client of ours has approached us about designing and > building a major > web portal project focused around a particular topic area > with extensive > member services and content management abilities. We now have to spec > this project out and at some point in the near future I will have to > decide on a WWW server/Application server/Database > combination. Zope is > in the running, along with WebObjects, NetObjects, ODI's ObjectStore + > ObjectForms, etc. That's great to hear that we're being considered with such an auspicious (if expensive :^) lineup! > My initial impulse is to go with Zope because of its low cost > overhead and > my expertise with Python as well as the access I have to this > mailing list > and so on. Unfortunately my desire to do implement python is > offset by a > few major concerns, and I would like to see if anybody out there could > address these questions/concerns: You've definately done a straightforward job of delineating the concerns. Thanks for the evenhanded treatment. > 1) Zope seems to want to operate in a configuration of > web server, Hmm, I disagree a bit here. I still recommend people use Apache. > application server, and object database all in one package. I have > managed to get Zope to run using ZServer + Apache PCGI, but the > performance seems quite quite dismal. My concern is mainly We certainly haven't seen dismal performance. Could you be more specific? I think you should expect a million hits per day on a $3k machine using Apache in front of Zope. If you're talking an order of magnitude more than that, then you might be right. But that would make your site one of the top ten Internet destinations :^) To be more specific, if you'd like a significant boost in Apache performance, write a mod_zope that eliminates the forking and pcgi-wrapper connection. Or contract with us to do it and put it back out in the community. > scalability: I > want to be able to use an industry standard web server (i.e. apache) > separate from the application server so that I could do > things like scale > using multiple web servers, etc. etc. There are a whole number of reasons to want to keep Apache in the mix. We run Apache on zope.org due to this. > 2) The same issue applies to the DB layer. After > floating through > all the documentation on the zope.org site I am unclear what the > relationship would be between Zope and an industrial strength database > like Oracle 8, etc. I am wary of using Zope's own object DB > because of It's certainly legitimate in these remaining weeks before Zope2 to fret about scale and the object database. We'll have a lot more confidence once Z ODB 3 comes out of testing. Until then, you're raising a legitimate point. As for compatibility, I realize that some people don't feel comfortable "locking" their database in a Data.bbb file. We're taking steps to make this decision easier (e.g. XML import/export, Zope2's ability to store its contents in one or more relational database tables, etc.). But those won't be ready for use for at least another month. > scale and compatibility issues, but most of the benefits of using Zope > would be mitigated if I ended up having to write SQL queries Correct. > to access my > Oracle database. The question is: is it possible to use a DB > like Oracle > or Postgres, etc. transparently and in the same manner that I would be > using Zope's native db? How about an object DB like ODI's > ObjectStore? Right, the idea for Z ODB 3 is that you can have multiple storage managers as part of one logical object system. The object system could be partitioned across three files, a Sybase table, and an Oracle table. It's likely that the part that stores data in the relational database might start out commercial, as well as the client-server version of the object database. > 3) Zope is not "standard" enough that should I get run over by a > truck development could proceed without me. Finding consultants and > programmers other than myself to work on this project could > be difficult. I completely realize that going with Zope is still a risky decision. However, the question of risk due to being non-standard is mostly offset by the risk of going with a closed-source vendor. Do you _really_ trust Apple et al. to be responsive to all of your issues? IMO, customers should demand control. Again, thanks a bunch for taking the time to write up a well-reasoned statement of the issues! Paul Everitt Digital Creations paul(a)digicool.com 540.371.6909 ----------------------------------------- The Open Source Zope application server http://www.zope.org/ -----------------------------------------

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Re: [Zope] Running external applications
by 이관수(LEE Kwan Soo) 28 Jun '99

28 Jun '99

Graham Chiu wrote: >I'm a newbie to Zope. Me, too. After 6monthes of Zoping. (which equals 6 week in ordinay time-space since I've been writing my dissertation.) >How does one run all ones legacy applications eg. windows executables, >perl scripts etc. Well, as far as I see, you can only run suitable imported "Python applications" as external methods. Yes, ONLY PYTHON APPLICATIONS. BUT .... PYTHON application CAN DO MANY THINGS. There is some ?COM support example went around a couple of weeks ago. So YOU CAN MANUPLATE any ?COM application which reside in the same machine with Zope. (I do not know about this esoteric art. maybe some guru and source can enlighten you). On the ugliest side, there is system function from os moudle in Python, i.e. import os os.system("bla bla bla") ..... .... You can run any application in this way. (in Wndows os.system("start this_program.exe") ). The ugly face is that you do not have any direct way to force communication between the applicaion launched(forked?) in this way and the Zope par se. Once I was and am in this situation (with wget on my linux box) and did the ugliest thing to control the non-Python application. I forced the non-Python application write verbose log and let an Python external method read the log and do something. ... So if you are at least an awful newbie like me, welcome hell aboard. :-) Of course there are much elegant solutions which I can only guess from the source which the Zopian Gods bless us with, but I am too lazy or busy too practice the source. May the Source be with you. LEE Kwan Soo.

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- FYI: Zope Roadmap for next two months
by Paul Everitt 23 Jun '99

23 Jun '99

Howdy all. I've attached below a quick snapshot of things happening for Digital Creations and Zope. The roadmap finally allows me to answer some of the questions coming up here in the Zope community. --Paul Paul Everitt Digital Creations paul(a)digicool.com 540.371.6909 Zope Roadmap For about two months I have made attempts to write down a roadmap that described future directions for Zope. I could never find the right format for detailing the items, though. No one likes to go on record making promises. I settled on the following format as a good compromise that allows me plenty of wiggle room. Each of the items below has a number between one and three in front of it. A one means we are quite likely to do it in the next two months. A three means we have done some work on it and are likely to do more work on it, but don't expect too much progress. The easiest way to get us to change priorities, of course, is through consulting. Many of the items in the list are in support of existing consulting projects. I'll start with Digital Creations, as some of the items we are looking at impact the Zope community. o (1) Hire seven more folks. I expect us to have concluded employment contracts with another seven people by the end of February 1999. We are pretty busy on consulting contracts right now and, as you can see, have quite a backlog of Zope work to do. o (1) Get ten case studies online. Just about everybody new to Zope and/or Python wants to see something done with it. We *have* done interesting work, we just need to package it up to make the case studies and testimonials visible. By the way, giving us some good words to put on the website about Zope really, really helps us convince newcomers to try it out, so pitch in! o (1) Relocate offices. By the end of January we will have switched offices as we need a lot more space. Needless to say we have a disruption facing us but we are doing a good job of managing it so far. o (1) Business plan for 1999. There are a couple of trends that are emerging on the scene in 1999, most notably the mainstreaming of open source. We would like to position ourselves to capitalize on these trends. Thus we are reviewing our business plan and having a board vote first week of February. o (1) Start a Zope Hosting Provider program. I have a page mostly finished for a signup and have two companies that have indicated serious interest. The following is a list of initiatives in the Zope area that are on our radar, though some rely on continued funding from consulting projects, which can be tough to predict: o (1) Tabula and indexing structures. We are going to begin a slow process of moving pieces of Tabula into Zope. The Zope 1.10 release will put the BTrees, integer sets, and indexing machinery into Zope. Tabula itself will be available just afterwards for a small audience of those willing to work with us on it. Over time this will mean Zope will scale up much, much more. In the nearterm it allows the Zopespot project to get kicked off. o (1) Start Zopespot. We have been planting seeds for a while to do a "Slashdot" in Zope. I have been working on a requirements document off-and-on for the last two weeks. More importantly, Ken Manheimer was hired to be the shepherd for this project. More to follow in a separate post. o (1) Release overhauled versions of the four main documentation artifacts. We hope to have by the end of this week new, overhauled versions of the Zope Manager's Guide, the DTML guide, and the SQL Methods (formerly Aqueduct) guide. When Tabula makes it out we will publish its documentation. o (1) Zope 1.10 released. Zope 1.10 will include: - BTrees and integer sets - The SearchIndex package which has a number of indexing classes, including classes for field indexes and text indexes. - Property management broken out into a separate mixin - Properties DTML Documents, Images, and Files - Image patches provided by Ty Syrna to allow size attributes - New absolute URL feature to allow images to referred to from different folders more easily - Bug fixes, plus anything else I've forgotten o (1) Relocate zope.org. Starting this week we are relocating the website which has a big fat pipe to the Internet, as well as people more talented than us to look at it. We'll make a separate announcement about this. o (1) Public CVS server. When Ken gets here I imagine he'll move pretty quickly to getting a public repository available using CVS or Perforce. o (2) Confera released. When the machinery from Tabula goes back into Zope we can brush up Confera and release it. Confera provides threaded discussions that include moderation, full-text searching, and more. Documentation was also written for it so we'll brush that off as well. o (1) WebDAV. Brian Lloyd has made quite a bit of progress on WebDAV. Our goal is to get Zope's hat in the ring for WebDAV as soon as realistically possible. o (1) Zope/Medusa with FTP. As you may have seen on Friday, Amos and Jim have worked with Sam to iron out an architecture document for Zope/Medusa. We should have an alpha release this month of Zope/Medusa with PCGI, HTTP, and FTP implemented as Medusa handlers. o (2) A formal Zope query language. Adding a standard query language, such as OQL or XQL, has recently become pretty important. I hope that we will show some progress on this over the next month or two. o (2) Zope2 beta with full concurrency. It is very important that we make progress on the architecture described by Jim's "BoboPOS3alpha1" paper. o (2) XML. Zope is a great fit for XML, even better with the machinery from Tabula going in. We also see XML becoming the basis for other initiatives, such as WebDAV and RDF. However, we just can't squeeze out the time to dive in deep. Rather, we'd love to see more community progress like that which popped up this weekend. o (3) Offer Collector. A good number of people have asked about contracting with us to get the Collector software for tracking bugs reports, feature requests, and more. Thus we might have a Zope-based solution available and packaged that our customers can drop into their sites. o (3) Replication. Being able to copy the contents of a main site to a local site, make changes while offline, then replicate them back up is a compelling opportunity for Zope. And it isn't that unrealistic, as some of the machinery is there already in the undocumented manage_exportHack operation. However, until it pops up on a consulting gig I doubt Digital Creations will return to it. o (3) Progress on "Python Interfaces", http://www.foretec.com/python/workshops/1998-11/dd-fulton-sum.html. Many of the initiatives we start around here seem to cross territory where we wish we had interfaces. Of course I might have forgotten a thing or two here or there. I'm sure you folks will let me know if I have. :^)

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Z Classes Tutorial: Rough Draft
by Amos Latteier 10 Jun '99

10 Jun '99

Hello Zope Fans: Here's the first rough draft of a Z Classes Tutorial. Take a look and let me know what you think. Please note that Z Classes are an *experimental feature* of Zope at this time. We debated about whether to make a release now or wait until Z Classes were more fully cooked (and until we had more bandwidth to answer questions about Z Classes). We decided to make a release now. I think that if you play with Z Classes you'll agree that they represent a very exciting development. Have fun, and send me your feed back on the tutorial, I'd love to improve it. -Amos -- Introducing Z Classes About this document Z Classes are an exciting addition to Zope which made their debut in the 1.11 release. This document is an introduction to using and understanding Z Classes. This information will be added to the Zope Manager's Guide soon. Important Warning *IMPORTANT NOTE: Z Classes are currently (as of Zope 1.11.0pr1) an experimental, unsupported feature in Zope.* Bugs still exist in the current Z Classes implementation. In addition new features will probably be added and existing features may be changed in the near future. We fully intend to make Z Classes rock solid, but we're just not there yet. Introduction What are Z Classes? Z Classes herald a big change in Zope. Classes allow you to build your own objects through the web. In effect, instead of being limited to existing objects like Folders, DTML Documents, when building your site, you can now define your own objects. For example, if your site includes things like employee manuals, bug reports, shopping malls, etc., then you can actually create Employee Manual objects, and Bug Report objects, and all the rest. In short, Z Classes let you create and store "your kinds of things" instead of Zope things. You define your Classes in the Control Panel, and then you can create and manipulate your objects just as you create and manipulate Folders, DTML Documents, and all the other standard Zope objects. As you change and update your Classes, all the existing instances of those classes are updated. So if you add a new method to your Employee Manual class, all your Employee Manual objects will be updated. You can even export your Classes and use them in different Zope installation, thus allowing you to leverage your work across Zope installations. Basically Zope classes make extending Zope much easier. In fact there is no Python programming required. This is a big change from the days of using the Product API and Python to extend Zope. Now building new Classes is easy enough that you justify making several specialized Classes to solve specific problems. Necessary Background To start with you should be familiar with creating Products though the Zope Control Panel. This process is outlined in the Zope Manager's Guide. http://www.zope.org/Documentation/Guides/ZMG/ Working with Zope classes builds on Zopes existing Product Creation facilities but extends it in important ways. The basic difference between creating traditional Products through the Control Panel and creating Z Class Products through the Control Panel is that with Classes, your objects retain a connection to their Classes. So when you make changes to your Class, your instances are updated. With traditional Control Panel Products, no such link between the Control Panel and the created object is retained. Getting Started Overview Let's begin using ZClasses by building a simple example Class that represent a music CD. In this scenario, we want to let people fill out forms that collect information about CDs in their music collection. To create new "records", people just choose your newly-defined "thing" from the kinds of "things" to add to their folder. Overview of Steps 1. Create a Z Class. 2. Provide some meta-information about the Z Class. 3. Define a property sheet for the Z Class. 4. Create a View. 5. Create a Factory. Creating a Simple ZClass Start by going to the Control Panel and creating a new Product. Choose "Product" from the add form and call it 'CDProduct'. Now go the the 'CDProduct' Product Folder and create a ZClass. For the Class 'id' specify 'CDClass'. Don't worry about the 'Selected Base Classes' widget. Click 'Add', and you've just created your first ZClass. Now let's set up our newly minted CD Class. Click on the 'CDClass' object inside the 'CDProduct' Folder. Now you are presented the the 'Basic' Class management screen. For now let's restrict ourselves to just supplying a 'meta-type' for our class. For the Class 'meta-type' specify 'CD'. 'meta-type' basically means Zope Product type. Creating a PropertySheet Now let's give our Class some properties. We can do this by creating one or more PropertySheets for our Class. A PropertySheet is a schema that describes what kind of properties instances of our Class will have. To create a PropertySheet click on the 'PropertySheets' tab. This takes you to the PropertySheets management screen. Let's create a PropertySheet by selecting 'Common Instance Property Sheet' from the Product add list. Then specify 'cd_info' as the id of the PropertySheet. Now you should have a new PropertySheet object listed on the PropertySheets management screen. Click on 'cd_info' to edit our PropertySheet. Now you should see a familiar Zope property setting management screen. It's important to remember that right now we are not setting the properties of an individual CD, but we are defining what properties which all CDs will have. So let's create a few properties. Create a 'title' and 'artist' property, both of type string. Then create a text property named 'description'. Creating a View Now let's add a View to our class which will let use manage these properties. A View is a management screen which is available via a management tab. Click the 'Views' tab to edit a Class's views. Now you should see that our Class currently has only one View, 'Security'. This view calls the Class's 'manage_access' method. Let's create a new view named 'Properties' which calls the Class's 'propertysheets/cd_info/manage' method. Fill out the 'New' form and then click 'Add'. Now you should see that our class has two Views. Let's make the 'Properties' View the first or default view by checking the checkbox next to it and clicking 'First'. Now Properties should be at the top of the list of Views. Creating Instances of the ZClass So far so good. We've created all the basic stuff we need to get our class working. Now we need to create a way to make instances of our Class. This process is basically identical to what is described in the Zope Manager's Guide. We'll need to build an add form and then create a Factory which will make our add form available from the Product add list. Let's build a very basic add form. Go to the 'CDProduct' Folder and create a new DTML Method. Give it an id of 'addForm' and give it these contents::  <H2>Add CD</H2> <table> <form action="CDClass"> <tr> <th>Id</th> <td><input type="text" name="id"></td></tr> <tr><td></td><td><input type="submit" value="Add"></td></tr> </form> </table>  This DTML Method basically displays a form which gathers the CD's id and then calls the Class. The Class will create an instance and plug it into the Folder from which the add method is called. The final step is to create a Factory to put this add form into the Product add list. Choose 'Zope Factory' from the Product add list and create a Factory with id 'CDFactory', add list name 'CD' and method 'addForm'. OK, now you should be able to create a CD object from most anywhere in Zope, by selecting 'CD' from the Product add list and filling out the add form. Using ZClass Instances. To find out more about our Class, let's explore an instance. Leave the Control Panel and create a CD object. Now click on the CD object you just created. You'll note that you can edit the CD's properties with the 'Properties' tab. You can also access your object's attributes via DTML. For example, suppose you created a CD object called 'SuperOldies_vol42'. In a DTML Document you can query this object like so:: <p>Information about a CD:</p>  <p>Title: </p> <p>Artist: </p> <p>Description: </p>  In other words, your CD object is a normal Zope object and you can access its properties just like you access a Folder's properties. You can also manipulate its properties in the same way you manipulate the properties of other Zope objects. For example, here's a DTML fragment that changes some properties of our CD object::  Instances of ZClasses inherit all the methods of their base classes. In our simple example, our CD class inherits the basic methods available to all simple Zope Products automatically without having to specify this. More Complex ZClass Topics Now that we have a basic example of a working ZClass, let's return to some of the details that we glossed over the first time. Basic ZClass Attributes On the 'Basic' ZClass management screen you can set the Class's icon in addition to defining a ZClass's 'meta-type'. This icon is used in the Zope management interface to identify instances of the ZClass. You should use a GIF file for your icon which is 16 by 16 pixels. It should have a transparent background. You can set a Class's icon by uploading the icon file. This will create the icon and define the icon's URL. You can change the icon by uploading new icon files. If you need to, you can change the URL of the icon, but in general this shouldn't be necessary. ZClasses and Inheritance When you first create a ZClass you are presented with a complex widget which allows you to specify your Class's base classes. You ZClass inherits the methods and attributes of all its base classes. If you do not specify any base classes your class will still inherit basic Zope features which are defined by the 'SimpleItem' class. This is generally what you want, and this allows instances of your class to perform normal Zope functions such as properties management. If you want your Class to be able to contain other objects, like a Folder does, then you'll have to subclass 'Object Manager'. This will provide you with all the standard methods to support object containment. Other base classes may be available in the future. You can also subclass other ZClasses. This is a very powerful feature. It allows you to build complex and related classes. Another thing to notice is that you can subclass more than one base class. This is one way in which Python differs from many other object-oriented languages. When you subclass more than one class, the order of the base classes is important, because it determines the order in which classes are searched when acquiring method and attributes. Creating Methods A Class's heavy lifting is done by its methods. In addition to defining a property schema, your main task in crafting a ZClass will be to build a collection of methods which manipulate your Class's properties and do useful work. To create methods for your Class, you simply create objects in the 'Methods' tab management view. For the most part your methods will consist of DTML Method objects, SQL Method objects and External Method objects. These Zope objects will provide all instances of your Class with services just as they would provide services to their enclosing Folders if they were not defined as ZClass methods. In other words, there is nothing new or unusual about method objects--they are simply made available to Class instances through the ZClass rather than through acquisition. One useful method to create is the special 'index_html' method which is used to display an object when called from the web. Just as Folder's manage their default view with an 'index_html' object, so you can control the default representation of your class. For example our CD class might define a DTML Method 'index_html' like so::  <h2>CD</h2> <p>Title: </p> <p>Artist: </p> <p>Description: </p>  Creating Views We've already covered almost all there is to creating Views. The only thing to add is that by default your ZClass starts with the same views as its subclasses. Creating Permissions Zope manages security though a system of permissions and roles. Users are assigned roles which are in bound to permissions for given objects. See the Zope Managers Guide for more information about security. For our purposes, you should understand that a Class's permissions define collections of methods which are grouped together in functional groups. Using Classes your job is not to set access controls on your Class, but to define permissions so that access controls can be set on instances of your Class. So you must define to permissions before they can be bound to roles. The first step in defining your Class's permissions should be to to create methods for your class. After your class can do something, then you should decide how to describe what it can do in terms of permissions. You must figure out if your methods should be covered by existing permissions of whether it would be better to create new permissions. For example if your class has an 'index_html' method, this method is used to view instances of the class, so you can probably use the existing 'View' permission with this method. If your class defines a number of methods for accessing remote servers, you might want to create a new permission for these methods called something like 'Access remote server'. To control what permission a given method is bound to, click the 'Security' tab while managing the Class's permission. You will be presented with a form which maps the method's permissions to the Class's permissions. This looks complex but in general you will only want to bind one permission of the method to a permission. In the case of DTML Methods this will be the 'View' method. The reason for this is that you really only want instances of your class to be able to 'View' a DTML Method. An instance should not be able to perform other actions on its methods such as editing. By going to the 'Permissions' management tab you can define your Class's permissions. You can create new permissions with the 'Add a new permission' form, and you may delete existing permissions. In general you should limit the number of new permissions you create, to the smallest reasonable number. By doing so you make it easier for managers to control the security settings of instances of your Class. Subobjects If you create an a ZClass which is a subclass of 'Object Manager' you'll be able to control what types of objects it can contain. The task is performed by clicking the 'Subobjects' management tab. From this management screen you can select object types which can be added to instances of your Class as subobjects. If the 'Objects should appear in folder lists' option is checked then instances of the class will appear expandable in the Zope management interface. In general this option is appropriate when you wish to make your object act like a normal Zope container. Conclusion The information here should be enough to get you going with Z Classes. We hope to expand this documentation soon and include much larger examples to show how you can build systems with multiple Z Classes that work together. Have fun!

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Problem with TinyTables under 1.11pr?
by Timothy Grant 07 Jun '99

07 Jun '99

Hi, I wanted to start messing with ZServer, so I downloaded the pre-release of 1.11, installed it, copied all the stuff I needed from 1.10 using "cp -Ru zope-old/* zope-new/*" started the new ZopeHTTPServer just to check things out, andwas tremendously chagrinned to find out that the two tiny tables in my app showed up as broken. I went and checked the permissions, etc, and couldn't find any problems, the rest of my site including the ZMySQLDA (which initially caused me no end of grief) were all working. What am I missing here? Thanks. -- Stand Fast, tjg. ============================================================== Timothy Grant VP Technology/CTO Avalon Technology Group, Inc. tjg(a)avalongroup.net www.avalongroup.net (503) 246-3630 (503) 246-3124 fax

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Any way of entering data into TinyTable via DTML?
by Tony McDonald 03 Jun '99

03 Jun '99

Hi, I've looked through the source for TinyTable B2 and can't see anything obvious. My requirement is to do a one-time SQL query to a MySQL database (the database content is not very dynamic) and then populate a TinyTree table with the results and use that for lookups later. possible? sensible? TIA Tone

3 2

web store
by Graham Chiu 02 Jun '99

02 Jun '99

I'm looking to convert my perl based web store ( which uses flat ascii files ) to Zope, and am looking for pointers on how to do this. The perl application uses dynamically generated HTML, and a sessionid variable which identifies the customer, and this is passed from page to page. The shopping basket is saved with the sessionid as a text file between pages. I've got to the point on how to access sql tables using Zope, but am wondering how to do the sessionid bit. I don't think I need to do authentication at this stage. Is there a working webstore type product around? ( I did download the emarket product, but when I tried to add an item to the basket, it then displayed the dtml to my browser! Furthermore I wish to grab the item from a sql table which emarket does not do. ) ------- Regards, Graham Chiu gchiu<at>compkarori.co.nz

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MySQL & lost server connections
by John Eikenberry 01 Jun '99

01 Jun '99

I seem to remember this being asked before, but I couldn't find anything in the archives... :P Basically, it looks like I'm losing my connection from Zope to the MySQL database. While the site remains busy, it stays connected, but if there's a long dead period the connection goes away. Both Zope and MySQL are running on the same BSDI 3.1 machine. Its Zope-1.10.2 and MySQL-3.21.33b. Is there anything I can do to fix this? Here's the traceback and error: ------------------------------------------------------------------ Error type: Error value: Lost connection to MySQL server during query Traceback (innermost last): File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/ZPublisher/Publish.py, line 877, in publish_module File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/ZPublisher/Publish.py, line 590, in publish (Info: /members/index2) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/OFS/DTMLMethod.py, line 155, in __call__ (Object: index2) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/OFS/DTMLMethod.py, line 151, in __call__ (Object: index2) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/DocumentTemplate/DT_String.py, line 513, in __call__ (Object: index2) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/DocumentTemplate/DT_With.py, line 138, in render (Object: db) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/DocumentTemplate/DT_In.py, line 617, in renderwob (Object: userid) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/Shared/DC/ZRDB/DA.py, line 390, in __call__ (Object: CopySource) File /usr/local/lib/Zope-1.10.2/lib/python/Products/ZMySQLDA/db.py, line 171, in query error: (see above) --- John Eikenberry [jae(a)kavi.com - http://taos.kavi.com/~jae/] ______________________________________________________________ "A society that will trade a little liberty for a little order will deserve neither and lose both." --B. Franklin

3 2

Object creation time
by Jay, Dylan 01 Jun '99

01 Jun '99

I'm trying to get the date an object was created (rather than its modification time). What method is this?

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