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Zope + Ape + Subversion (was: RE: [Zope-dev] Using a truely revis ion based storage for Zope ?)
by Jean-Francois.Doyon＠CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca 16 Apr '04

16 Apr '04

G'Day, Well, step one is done ... I now have Zope + Ape using Subversion as it's "filesystem" !! This is step one because, as Shawn suggested (Thanks for the pointer, that's what I needed!), this simply means that Zope uses SVN purely as a filesystem. Because of subversion's nature, I want to look at 2 things beyond this that traditional filesystems don't support: - Use zope's username for SVN logging. - History/Undo support: View past revisions of an object, and revert to such a past revision. - Zope Version support: SVN is fully transactional and atomic, this should allow for support of Zope versions (I think ?) In the longer term, there's great opportunity for: - "Built-in" conflict management and resolution: No more need for a "SafetyBelt" type approach. Right now I haven't looked at this at all. I plan to implement smart merging where possible (It might work already actually, I just need to test it). True conflicts (Where a merge can't be accomplished withouth user interaction) would raise some sort of conflict error. - Editing Zope content objects through interaction with the svn repository. I can checkout the repository, edit some objects, and chek them back in, never interacting with Zope directly ... I've already tried this ! Works great for text based content types such as PageTemplates or DTML Documents and so on ... I even did it with a JPG, though because the properties hold width and height, you get some weird looking pictures :) The concept is valid though. There may someday be a way to leverage this functionality better with a purpose built client of some sort. - Leveraging SVN's property management. Content in SVN has properties, much like Zope does. I haven't looked at it yet, but I've noticed ".properties" file appearing ... I'm guessing those are the Zope properties, which would be better handled by subversion's property mechanism. And properties are versioned too ! In the realm of the wishful thinking, there's even more: Right now, HEAD (Latest/youngest revision) is always used and worked with. The really powerful feature I want to eventually get to is publsihing something of a given revision, while editing another. One potential paradigm for distiguishing between the two modes of operation could be to use anonymous vs. authenticated. This is not useful to everyone, but can be in certain circumstances, most notably where authenticated = authors/developpers and anonymous = normal users. This however requires ZMI interfaces, and in my case CMF ones as well ... This would be global though ... Eventually it'd be nice to have per object control of this stuff. Andy McKay says it can't be done, anybody care to contradict him ? :P I image I'd have to monkey pathc something DEEP in the Zope code base, but I find the mix-in class that's the commonn denominator ... why not ? Right now I've been working within the "fs" module of apelib. I'm going to split it off into a seperate one so that it's a clean merge with Ape's code base, in case someone wants to try it, or it eventually makes into Ape's default distribution ?? ;) Anyways, I'm just rambling by now ... Comments, thoughts and constructive criticism welcome ! Thanks, J.F. -----Original Message----- From: zope-dev-bounces(a)zope.org [mailto:zope-dev-bounces@zope.org]On Behalf Of Shane Hathaway Sent: April 8, 2004 11:20 AM To: Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca Cc: zope-dev(a)zope.org Subject: Re: [Zope-dev] Using a truely revision based storage for Zope ? Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca wrote: > I've started looking at the ZODB and APE packages to try and get some > understanding of how the whole storage interaction works, but it'll take me > some time to figure it all out ... So I thought I'd get feedback on the idea > first ... Sounds great! If I were you, I would start by replacing Ape/lib/apelib/fs/fileops.py with something that uses the Subversion module. It's a very simple module and you should be able to get pretty far that way. Shane _______________________________________________ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev(a)zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )

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class methods in Persistent objects
by Syver Enstad 16 Apr '04

16 Apr '04

Is it possible to have class methods on ZODB Persistent objects? I am using 3.2 so that means I am using ExtensionClass. I guess that moving to 3.3 would mean being able to use class methods? What is the expected time that the 3.3 release will be ready for production use?

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Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: [Zope-dev] Re: More arguments for "z" (was Re: Zope and zope)
by Barry Warsaw 15 Apr '04

15 Apr '04

On Thu, 2004-04-15 at 11:39, Casey Duncan wrote: > Additionally (and Jim and I have discussed this amongst ourselves) I > feel strongly that the dependancies should be enforced by tests. Good point. > The dependancy tests might need to be separate from unittests because > they would probably require an import hook or somesuch. Perhaps a tool > like pychecker could be leveraged or extended to provide this service. > At a minimum this test would need to be run before packaging a > distribution, but ideally would happen more often. I wonder if some kind of doctest could be added to the __init__.py of the package that hooked __import__ and then attempted to import each module in the package, tracking the imports. Then complain about anything not defined in DEPENDENCIES.cfg (and hmm, what to do about standard library imports?). Yeah, maybe some kind of pychecker hook would be better. :/ -Barry

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ZPT in Zope Products
by Wyatt Anderson 15 Apr '04

15 Apr '04

Hello All, I am trying to use ZPT within a Zope Product I am trying to build. I want to test the container type I am addding to to determine what action to take. The following though from Products.PageTemplates.PageTemplateFile import PageTemplateFile def manage_addMyContainerForm(self, REQUEST): pt = None if self.meta_type in ['ContainerType1', 'ContainerType2']: pt = PageTemplateFile('zpt/addMyContainerForm', globals()) else: pt = PageTemplateFile('zpt/containerError', globals()) return pt.pt_render() This produces the following traceback in Zope: Traceback (innermost last): Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 100, in publish Module ZPublisher.mapply, line 88, in mapply Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 40, in call_object Module Products.MyContainer.MyContainer, line 17, in manage_addMyContainerForm Module Products.PageTemplates.PageTemplate, line 90, in pt_render - <PageTemplateFile at containerError> Module Products.PageTemplates.PageTemplateFile, line 73, in pt_getContext TypeError: 'str' object is not callable I've checked out the code in PageTemplate.py and PageTemplateFile.py and can't figure out what is going on. The line in question is root = self.getPhysicalRoot() Is it possibly some security thing? My class is setDefaultAccess('allow') for now. I've also tried simply return pt with no traceback but without the desired results as the object is returned. Thanks in advance, Wyatt

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ZODB for Java?
by Ian Beatty 15 Apr '04

15 Apr '04

Greetings. Does anyone know of a good (stable, reliable, fast enough for production use in a web app) ZODB-equivalent for persisting Java objects? Thanks, ..Ian -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- Dr. Ian Beatty beatty(a)physics.umass.edu Physics Education Research voice: 413.545.9483 Department of Physics fax: 413.545.4884 Univ. of Massachusetts AIM: (available upon request) Amherst, MA 01003-9337 USA http://umperg.physics.umass.edu/ -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- -- --- --

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Re: Fw: Re: VerboseSecurity Zope2.7
by Shane Hathaway 15 Apr '04

15 Apr '04

On Thu, 15 Apr 2004, Arthur Chan Chi Chuen wrote: > I know you're pretty busy preparing the SVN stuff, but let me ask you a quick > question about VerboseSecurity. Sorry, I didn't mean to drop this. My inbox got too full. :-) > Someone online said the cvs.zope.org works in 2.7, but it's not. Alex Limi > has tried it and said it failed too. So, will VerboseSecurity has a > compatible version with 2.7 soon? I'm waiting for this cool product, it will > save my life. Well, a bunch of us are actively using the VerboseSecurity HEAD with Zope-2_7-branch. It works OK, except that you can't see the name of the permission. However, you can still see the roles, user, executable owner, proxy roles, etc. when an authorization failure occurs. Shane

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RE: [Zope-dev] More arguments for "z" (was Re: [Zope3-dev] Zope a nd zope)
by Jean-Francois.Doyon＠CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

+1 from me ! I'm always in favor of less typing :P Besides, you make good points :) J.F. -----Original Message----- From: zope-dev-bounces(a)zope.org [mailto:zope-dev-bounces@zope.org]On Behalf Of Jim Fulton Sent: April 14, 2004 3:54 PM To: jim(a)zope.com Cc: zope3-dev(a)zope.org; zope-dev(a)zope.org Subject: [Zope-dev] More arguments for "z" (was Re: [Zope3-dev] Zope and zope) Jim Fulton wrote: > Jim Fulton wrote: > > ... > >> Give the responses. I need to recast my question as a selection >> among alternatives. But, before I do that, we will need to consider >> alternatives a bit more. > > > OK, here's another. > > What about renaming the Zope 3 zope package to "z". > > - It fits with the expansion of "Zope": > "Z Object Publishing Environment". > > - It's short :) > > - *At this time* (but after the move to svn), it's not too hard to make > a change like this for Zope 3. Backward compatibility is not a big > issue. This will change when X3.0 is released, which is why I'm > bothering to deal with this now. > > - This was suggested a couple of years ago when coming up with the > Zope 3 package layout. > > Examples (from the buddydemo example): > > import z.interface > from z.app import zapi > from z.app.event import publish > from z.app.event.objectevent import ObjectModifiedEvent Other reasons I like "z": - Less noise in imports - Echos the "circle z" - The packages in "z" can be used for more than just Zope - Emphasizes the more "minimalist" nature of Zope 3 relative to Zope 2 - "z" is a component of "zope" OK, I'm getting carried away. Sorry ;) Jim -- Jim Fulton mailto:jim@zope.com Python Powered! CTO (540) 361-1714 http://www.python.org Zope Corporation http://www.zope.com http://www.zope.org _______________________________________________ Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev(a)zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope )

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how to get the icon of a product
by Garito 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

Hi I try to get the icons of the installed products I try to get it with the self.all_meta_types()/instance/icon My better result is something like: misc_/Audio/mp3.gif with these path I can use: self.unrestrictedTraverse(icon) where icon is the path above (misc_/Audio/mp3.gif) With these approach some icons are correct other are not found is there any good way to get these info? Thanks a lot!!

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RE: Zope + Ape + Subversion (was: RE: [Zope-dev] Using a truely r evis ion based storage for Zope ?)
by Jean-Francois.Doyon＠CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

Shane, Thanks for the extra tips, I'll check out those interfaces! I'm also getting up to speed on the whole mapper concept, where the work regarding properties handling seems to be ? I've done some reading, and I need to do some more, but I'll get there :) As for the seperation of code ... I now have a "subversion" directory as a sibbling to "fs" ... I had to edit a couple of files outside that directory, but still the seperation is nicer. eventually I'd have to make it into a product, is that doable ? J.F. -----Original Message----- From: Shane Hathaway To: Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca Cc: zope-dev(a)zope.org Sent: 13/04/2004 11:43 AM Subject: Re: Zope + Ape + Subversion (was: RE: [Zope-dev] Using a truely revis ion based storage for Zope ?) On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca wrote: > This is step one because, as Shawn suggested (Thanks for the pointer, that's > what I needed!), this simply means that Zope uses SVN purely as a > filesystem. > > Because of subversion's nature, I want to look at 2 things beyond this that > traditional filesystems don't support: To take this to the next level, you need to implement IFSReader and IFSWriter instead of the more basic file operations interface. See Ape/lib/apelib/fs/interfaces.py. In IFSReader/IFSWriter, you're a little closer to objects, and you work with OIDs instead of paths. I expect that history and version support will require us to augment IFSReader or add another interface. > - Use zope's username for SVN logging. > - History/Undo support: View past revisions of an object, and revert to such > a past revision. > - Zope Version support: SVN is fully transactional and atomic, this should > allow for support of Zope versions (I think ?) These seem doable. > In the longer term, there's great opportunity for: > > - "Built-in" conflict management and resolution: No more need for a > "SafetyBelt" type approach. Right now I haven't looked at this at all. I > plan to implement smart merging where possible (It might work already > actually, I just need to test it). True conflicts (Where a merge can't be > accomplished withouth user interaction) would raise some sort of conflict > error. This could be complicated, because after the merge you have to be sure Zope caches the merged state rather than either of the intermediate states. The idea has potential, though! > - Editing Zope content objects through interaction with the svn repository. > I can checkout the repository, edit some objects, and chek them back in, > never interacting with Zope directly ... I've already tried this ! Works > great for text based content types such as PageTemplates or DTML Documents > and so on ... I even did it with a JPG, though because the properties hold > width and height, you get some weird looking pictures :) The concept is > valid though. There may someday be a way to leverage this functionality > better with a purpose built client of some sort. Sounds neat. Fortunately, Ape doesn't have to be aware of this. :-) > - Leveraging SVN's property management. Content in SVN has properties, much > like Zope does. I haven't looked at it yet, but I've noticed ".properties" > file appearing ... I'm guessing those are the Zope properties, which would > be better handled by subversion's property mechanism. And properties are > versioned too ! I think you'll find this easy to do once you implement IFSReader/IFSWriter. > In the realm of the wishful thinking, there's even more: > > Right now, HEAD (Latest/youngest revision) is always used and worked with. > The really powerful feature I want to eventually get to is publsihing > something of a given revision, while editing another. One potential > paradigm for distiguishing between the two modes of operation could be to > use anonymous vs. authenticated. This is not useful to everyone, but can be > in certain circumstances, most notably where authenticated = > authors/developpers and anonymous = normal users. This however requires ZMI > interfaces, and in my case CMF ones as well ... This would be global though > ... Eventually it'd be nice to have per object control of this stuff. Andy > McKay says it can't be done, anybody care to contradict him ? :P I image I'd > have to monkey pathc something DEEP in the Zope code base, but I find the > mix-in class that's the commonn denominator ... why not ? Well, CMFStaging is designed to address this need. To do this at the database level, you could use versions. > Right now I've been working within the "fs" module of apelib. I'm going to > split it off into a seperate one so that it's a clean merge with Ape's code > base, in case someone wants to try it, or it eventually makes into Ape's > default distribution ?? ;) You can add a new module, perhaps 'svnops.py', to the 'fs' package. Then we should make the choice between fileops and svnops configurable. Shane

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RE: Zope + Ape + Subversion (was: RE: [Zope-dev] Using a truely r evis ion based storage for Zope ?)
by Jean-Francois.Doyon＠CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca 14 Apr '04

14 Apr '04

Hello, Hmmm, well it's as stable as Ape and Subversion are respectively :) I wouldn't call it stable no, it's something I did over the long week-end we just had, and that's about it :) Ape is at 0.8 and therefore becoming quite mature, I'd have to let others speak as to it stability however ... Subversion is also probably quite stable (It just reached 1.0), though I don't know how heavily tested it's been in a long running process (Might it have some memeory leaks ?) ... Basically, I wouldn't recommend for usage yet. I'm not even distributing it just yet, mostly simply because right now it's code is still intermingled with Ape's ... As soon as I pull it out into a seperate product I'll be sure ot post it on zope.org and notify the list, as I'm sure I'll be looking for feedback/testers. I would estimate that moment to be weeks away though ... Thanks, J.F. -----Original Message----- From: Arthur Chan Chi Chuen To: Kapil Thangavelu; Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca Cc: zope-dev-bounces(a)zope.org; shane(a)zope.com; zope-dev(a)zope.org Sent: 13/04/2004 2:13 PM Subject: Re: Zope + Ape + Subversion (was: RE: [Zope-dev] Using a truely revis ion based storage for Zope ?) Hi all, I've read your discussion about version control, it seems a cool thing you guys making good progress. Btw, can I ask is the Ape using Subversion in Zope stable? how able CMF stuff? I wanna make/find a document management system which can provide some kinda version control in Plone. Thanks Arthur On Tue, 13 Apr 2004 04:06:26 -0400, Kapil Thangavelu wrote > On Mon, 2004-04-12 at 18:03, Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca wrote: > > G'Day, > > > > Well, step one is done ... I now have Zope + Ape using Subversion as it's > > "filesystem" !! > > > > cool! > > > This is step one because, as Shawn suggested (Thanks for the pointer, that's > > what I needed!), this simply means that Zope uses SVN purely as a > > filesystem. > > > > > Because of subversion's nature, I want to look at 2 things beyond this that > > traditional filesystems don't support: > > > > - Use zope's username for SVN logging. > > using AccessControl.getSecurityManager().getUser().getId() and > setting it up as a revision prop ( or directly when creating the > repo transaction) should do it. > > > - History/Undo support: View past revisions of an object, and revert to such > > a past revision. > > perhaps the code for this would be helpful, (remove image for code > link) http://zope.org/Members/k_vertigo/Products/CMFSubversionBrowser/FileRevi sions. png > > > - Zope Version support: SVN is fully transactional and atomic, this should > > allow for support of Zope versions (I think ?) > > > > zope version support isn't really all that worthwhile, esp in a cmf > context. in general zope's version support (or zodb more > particularly) is a database level feature masquerading as an > application one. since objects modified in a version are in essence > locked from participating in other transactions, actions like > modifying content in a version in a cmf site amounts to locking the > catalog from changes outside of the version, which amounts to > shutting down write activities to a cmf site. otoh, integration with > zope's transaction manager would be a good thing, although its > problematic to integrate between svn and zope txn models, more on > that in a moment. > > > In the longer term, there's great opportunity for: > > > > - "Built-in" conflict management and resolution: No more need for a > > "SafetyBelt" type approach. Right now I haven't looked at this at all. I > > plan to implement smart merging where possible (It might work already > > actually, I just need to test it). True conflicts (Where a merge can't be > > accomplished withouth user interaction) would raise some sort of conflict > > error. > > > > i don't know that conflict management is really useful in this context. > svn like zope relies on optimistic concurrency control, and currently > doesn't support dav locking (which zope does). ie, it will just > throw an error if the content has been changed since the transaction > began. the 'normal' concurrency control of svn is better but > dependent on using the working copy (wc) layer, which is additional > programming and storage overhead. so at the layer of the svn client > this is already done and working and good, but integrating this > functionality into zope is a bit harder without wc overhard. > > this also makes the transaction integration becomes harder because both > zope and svn are using what amounts to optimistic concurrency control > which makes it impossible afaics, to get real txn integration, ie in > zope's two phase commit strategy, the last chance for a participant > to safely abort is tpc_vote, but there is no real way of knowing if > the svn txn will suceed or not until its tried. if it is tried at > this stage and succeeds then there is the possibility of a latter > txn participant failing the tpc_vote and the txn being aborted, and > if waits till tpc_finish (last part of two phase commit) and the svn > txn fails it can hose the composite txn integrity. > > once svn supports dav locks, doing txn integration via resource locking > as part of tpc_vote (or earlier) would be possible, till then.. i > dunno, i can't see a way around this for real txn integration. > > i'm also curious how you dealt with svn transactions as part of the ape > integration work to date. > > > - Editing Zope content objects through interaction with the svn repository. > > I can checkout the repository, edit some objects, and chek them back in, > > never interacting with Zope directly ... I've already tried this ! Works > > great for text based content types such as PageTemplates or DTML Documents > > and so on ... I even did it with a JPG, though because the properties hold > > width and height, you get some weird looking pictures :) The concept is > > valid though. There may someday be a way to leverage this functionality > > better with a purpose built client of some sort. > > to me this is one of the fundamental benefits of using svn, giving users > the ability to use interfaces like tortoisesvn (win shell extensions) > or mac finder extensions to interact directly with content. > > > > > - Leveraging SVN's property management. Content in SVN has properties, much > > like Zope does. I haven't looked at it yet, but I've noticed ".properties" > > file appearing ... I'm guessing those are the Zope properties, which would > > be better handled by subversion's property mechanism. And properties are > > versioned too ! > > definitely! > > > > > In the realm of the wishful thinking, there's even more: > > > > Right now, HEAD (Latest/youngest revision) is always used and worked with. > > The really powerful feature I want to eventually get to is publsihing > > something of a given revision, while editing another. One potential > > paradigm for distiguishing between the two modes of operation could be to > > use anonymous vs. authenticated. This is not useful to everyone, but can be > > in certain circumstances, most notably where authenticated = > > authors/developpers and anonymous = normal users. This however requires ZMI > > interfaces, and in my case CMF ones as well ... This would be global though > > ... Eventually it'd be nice to have per object control of this stuff. Andy > > McKay says it can't be done, anybody care to contradict him ? :P I image I'd > > have to monkey pathc something DEEP in the Zope code base, but I find the > > mix-in class that's the commonn denominator ... why not ? > > > > to me this seems a separate point then svn usage at all, its really > about content view paradigms for revision workflow. the two predominant > ones are using staging to deploy different sites representing different > parts of the publication cycle/wf, and the other which afaik, is only > widely used by silva is view multiplexing where the view of a > content is responsible for retrieving the proper version to render a > display for, although afaicr silva support for such is initimately > tied to its workflow and versioning paradigm. > > > Anyways, I'm just rambling by now ... Comments, thoughts and constructive > > criticism welcome ! > > i've done some thinking and work with integration of svn as content > in zope as well, though using a different software stack than ape. some > notes/ideas culled from a dev diary i kept while working on it that > might be useful. > > - using svn hook scripts for event notification back into zope (content > reindex), although it should be careful about modifying the content > otherwise some client which just committed might be put out of date. > > - transform layers (using portal transforms) with a private content type > registry... although integrating at the ape layer this might not be > as useful. > > cheers, > > -kapil > > > > > Thanks, > > J.F. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: zope-dev-bounces(a)zope.org [mailto:zope-dev-bounces@zope.org]On > > Behalf Of Shane Hathaway > > Sent: April 8, 2004 11:20 AM > > To: Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)ccrs.nrcan.gc.ca > > Cc: zope-dev(a)zope.org > > Subject: Re: [Zope-dev] Using a truely revision based storage for Zope ? > > > > > > Jean-Francois.Doyon(a)CCRS.NRCan.gc.ca wrote: > > > I've started looking at the ZODB and APE packages to try and get some > > > understanding of how the whole storage interaction works, but it'll take > > me > > > some time to figure it all out ... So I thought I'd get feedback on the > > idea > > > first ... > > > > Sounds great! If I were you, I would start by replacing > > Ape/lib/apelib/fs/fileops.py with something that uses the Subversion > > module. It's a very simple module and you should be able to get pretty > > far that way. > > > > Shane > > _______________________________________________ > Zope-Dev maillist - Zope-Dev(a)zope.org > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ) -- Open WebMail Project (http://openwebmail.org)

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