April 2007 - Zope-Dev

Zope Tests: 5 OK
by Zope Tests Summarizer 20 Apr '07

20 Apr '07

Summary of messages to the zope-tests list. Period Thu Apr 19 12:00:00 2007 UTC to Fri Apr 20 12:00:00 2007 UTC. There were 5 messages: 5 from Zope Unit Tests. Tests passed OK --------------- Subject: OK : Zope-2.7 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Thu Apr 19 20:50:27 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007608.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.8 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Thu Apr 19 20:51:58 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007609.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.9 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Thu Apr 19 20:53:29 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007610.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.10 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Thu Apr 19 20:54:59 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007611.html Subject: OK : Zope-trunk Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Thu Apr 19 20:56:30 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007612.html

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Re: Killer App for ZClasses
by Alan Milligan 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

Christopher Lozinski wrote: > I do have an accounting application I want to bring up quickly, and this > seems to me the fastest way to bring it up, but also > to have an upgrade path to the future. We do http://www.last-bastion.net/BastionLedger which is a full double entry general ledger with an entire order management workflow suite with skinnable order/invoice forms. Just download it and install it. Alan

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The ZClass Decision I face
by Christopher Lozinski 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

Thank you very much for all the support. A lot of it was warnings about the pitfalls facing me. There was an excellent email in support of Grok. I added that to the ZClass wiki. While I did not get any software written yet, I am pleased to say that I upgraded the Zope Wiki on ZClasses. Someone should find that helpful. It is clear that I have a very hard decision in front of me. Those of us who want to use ZClasses, have a very hard choice to make. Stay with a broken ZClass implementation, fix ZClasses and break Zope 2 and fork the Zope tree, or write a new version of ZClasses in Zope 3 and leave our legacy applications behind. I have been very happy with my Choice of Zope 2 many years ago. I now better understand its limitations. The problem is that whichever path I take, I have to live with it. Regards Chris

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Zope Tests: 5 OK
by Zope Tests Summarizer 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

Summary of messages to the zope-tests list. Period Wed Apr 18 12:00:00 2007 UTC to Thu Apr 19 12:00:00 2007 UTC. There were 5 messages: 5 from Zope Unit Tests. Tests passed OK --------------- Subject: OK : Zope-2.7 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Wed Apr 18 20:53:16 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007603.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.8 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Wed Apr 18 20:54:46 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007604.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.9 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Wed Apr 18 20:56:17 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007605.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.10 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Wed Apr 18 20:57:48 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007606.html Subject: OK : Zope-trunk Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Wed Apr 18 20:59:19 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007607.html

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Re: Killer App for ZClasses
by Philipp von Weitershausen 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

On 19 Apr 2007, at 08:25 , Christopher Lozinski wrote: > The problem with upgrading ZClasses is that it would break the zope > security models, and the Zope Product Model. That depends on what you by "upgrading ZClasses". To make them continue to work, simpler changes will probably suffice. It seems, though, that you want to create this next generation of ZClasses that has a simpler security model, form generation built-in etc. So that would be a rewrite as you've already mentioned. But I don't think it's worth all that work. Writing filessytem code can be just as agile. That's of course just one man's opinion.

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ZClass Wiki Upgrade
by Christopher Lozinski 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

Thanks for all the great feedback. I particularly liked someone's idea of upgrading the ZClass Wiki, so that there is a good source of information at 1 easily accessible location. I think it is very important as a community to operate on a shared blackboard. Not quite as good as writing code, but an important first step. http://wiki.zope.org/zope2/ZClasses I added a page on where I want ZClasses to go. There are two pages on the problems with ZClasses. Read that TWO! There is a page on alternatives to ZClasses. There is a link to the deprecation annoucement. I tried to add some formatting to the page. I am not sure how to make the word "ZClass" not link to the same page. I do have an accounting application I want to bring up quickly, and this seems to me the fastest way to bring it up, but also to have an upgrade path to the future. I invite you all to make your edits there. Regards Chris

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Why are ZClasses Dead
by Christopher Lozinski 19 Apr '07

19 Apr '07

I keep getting these negative email messages. Here is the most recent example. >I think you should stop dreaming and face the reality. There is almost nobody interested of the developer community in ZClasses.. I have no idea what your >goal is with your ongoing ZClasses postings..you're on siding and there is no way back. My goal is to deliver maintain and expand the software my business needs to run. In particular I am looking for a very very fast development environment, so whatever changes a client needs, I can make right away. So I literally do not understand why people think ZClasses are dead. Let me go through the possible reasons. The last one is the real reason I think. 1. There is no demand for a through the web development environment that works. I just don't believe that. 2. ZClasses have the following bug. That sounds better. That bug needs to get fixed. I have yet to be hurt by a ZClass bug. Although there are some features I now want. 3. There is no one to maintain ZClasses Again not true, I need to do it for my own interests. I am at the point where I want to upgrade ZClasses. 4. ZClasses is a single user development environment. That is right, and I am a single user developer. Part time at that, I recruit the rest of the time. And I am looking for some good python developers if you are interested. The only reason I can do both jobs is that ZClasses allow me to develop my applications very fast. 5. You have to do everything in Python Classes on the file system. That is the right way to do things. Dogma has its place, but I have long since left organized religion. OUCH! 6. We are moving ZClasses out of the core. Makes sense to me. AND HERE IS THE REAL ISSUE I THINK 7. Because of the way Zope is written, you just cannot do ZClasses "right". You would have to change zope, and break lots of things. I think that is the core reason that some people say ZClasses are dead. I am just starting to understand it. I have been digging into the core of Zope. I keep excavating lower than I have ever excavated before. I would like to make a tree of classes, just like in the smalltalk browsers. Zope Products manager or whatever it is called does not like that. I would like a ZClass to have a subobject for every instance variable, and for that instance variable to say which role can read, and write it, independent of where you are in the ZODB tree. Not quite how Zope permissions work. So I think the structure of Zope prevents ZClasses from working correctly. Which is why ZClasses needs to die. Is that correct? Because to change the core of Zope is way too heretical. Better for ZClasses to die, than to change the core of Zope 2. Anyhow I would be grateful if any of the ZClasses-are-dead community would be more specific. Which reason makes you think that ZClasses are dead? Does anyone out there agree with my analysis? Regards Chris

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egg issues: adding namespace boilerplate Products / patching testrunner
by whit 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

2 items: 1. how does everyone feel about adding the following boilerplate to all occurences of Products/__init__.py to enable the easy creation of Product eggs? try: __import__('pkg_resources').declare_namespace(__name__) except ImportError: from pkgutil import extend_path __path__ = extend_path(__path__, __name__) 2. Could we consider this a defect so it could be added to relavent maintenance branches(provided no one sees any harm in #1. I mainly care about zope 2.9) 3. daniel nouri has made a patch for the test runner to enable a flag optionally add all packages on your path to the test search path. I consider this a defect in the current test runner that makes working with eggs and 2.9 or 2.10 rather cumbersome. could we consider adding this or some other solution to this problem? http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/2276 -w -- ------ d. whit morriss ------ - senior engineer, opencore - - http://www.openplans.org - - m: 415-710-8975 - "If you don't know where you are, you don't know anything at all" Dr. Edgar Spencer, Ph.D., 1995

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Zope Installers for Windows: ready for testing
by Sidnei da Silva 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

It's that time again... fire up your VMs and do some testing. Let's get those up on the website ASAP! http://files.enfoldsystems.com/Zope-2.10.3-Final-7151.exe http://files.enfoldsystems.com/Zope-2.9.7-Final-7151.exe -- Sidnei da Silva Enfold Systems http://enfoldsystems.com Fax +1 832 201 8856 Office +1 713 942 2377 Ext 214

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Zope Tests: 5 OK
by Zope Tests Summarizer 18 Apr '07

18 Apr '07

Summary of messages to the zope-tests list. Period Tue Apr 17 12:00:00 2007 UTC to Wed Apr 18 12:00:00 2007 UTC. There were 5 messages: 5 from Zope Unit Tests. Tests passed OK --------------- Subject: OK : Zope-2.7 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Apr 17 20:54:06 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007598.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.8 Python-2.3.6 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Apr 17 20:55:37 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007599.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.9 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Apr 17 20:57:08 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007600.html Subject: OK : Zope-2.10 Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Apr 17 20:58:39 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007601.html Subject: OK : Zope-trunk Python-2.4.4 : Linux From: Zope Unit Tests Date: Tue Apr 17 21:00:10 EDT 2007 URL: http://mail.zope.org/pipermail/zope-tests/2007-April/007602.html

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